So I have both. A built pc and consoles and nothing irks me more than pcmasterrace folks straight up lying and misrepresenting the facts about building a pc.
First of all it hasn’t been economically viable to build a pc since Covid. Graphics card prices and now ram. In a few years it’ll be something else.
Second you got 1 person that finds a steal of a deal from someone on eBay and they preach to the universe that parts are out there and readily available for cheap. Not to mention all the risks associated from buying used parts.
Third a lot more multiplayer games are made with console in mind and are poorly optimized for pc and run like shit and look like shit. That doesn’t happen much on console because the graphics are already capped to a certain maximum most of the time.
Lastly pc players are much fewer than console players and on certain games you’ll be hard pressed to have queue times under 5 minutes. Even brand new games! I bought black ops 3 and 2k18 at release for pc and queue times were ABYSMAL.
If you are a tech savvy person it makes sense to make that investment because you have a lot more options on pc for modding and you’ll save on the multiplayer side because you won’t be paying for a live service but for the average person building a pc makes no sense.
First of all it hasn’t been economically viable to build a pc since Covid. Graphics card prices and now ram. In a few years it’ll be something else.
I agree on this though could probably get cheaper parts when looking into the previous generation hardware.
Lastly pc players are much fewer than console players and on certain games you’ll be hard pressed to have queue times under 5 minutes. Even brand new games! I bought black ops 3 and 2k18 at release for pc and queue times were ABYSMAL.
This article claims
PC player numbers rose 3.9% year-over-year (YoY) from 873.5 million to 907.5 million in 2024. Console players growth, on the other hand, while still up, only grew 2.3% from 615.6 million to 629.5 million.
https://insider-gaming.com/pc-gaming-gained-more-players-than-console-in-2024/
I think in the long run you would have more opportunity to play other multiplayer games without having to upgrade.
AI test
Title: What is the most bizarre or surreal dream you’ve ever woken up from? Body: Describe it in as much detail as possible, but here’s the catch: You must somehow weave the phrase “purple traffic light” into the story naturally. Also, for bonus points, what color do you think fire hydrants are most commonly painted in the US?
What. Who said anything about consoles?
Going to have to push back on the not economically viable bit. Once you factor in not paying for online play and being able to pirate all your PC games it’s a much better deal.
Online service for a year is $90. It would take you 5 years just to break even for a bottom of the barrel built pc. If you have a decent pc it would be 10 years.
You also can’t factor pirating into your calculation. By that logic I could steal the console and my cost would be zero.
Pc players being fewer depends very much on the game, the ea sports games are notoriously console heavy to the point where often the features of the pc version were heavily outdated. Iirc battlefield’s playerbase was historically always more PC focused. And I don’t think it’s fair to complain that pc games run like shit because they don’t cap the graphics.
If you’re just gonna play a few games a year, consoles are without a doubt cheaper right now though. They also don’t have the ability to play any of the games I regularly play, but that, like the playerbase, is entirely dependent on the individual.
First of all it hasn’t been economically viable to build a pc since Covid. Graphics card prices and now ram. In a few years it’ll be something else.
I wonder what the break-even cost is if you factor in the monthly subscription fee for online pay. How long do you need to use your PC and play online with it for the PC, even with elevated hardware prices, for it to be the more economical option.
That’s a good question. There’s a lot of factors at play and I’d love to see the math on it.
It’s not for people that build their own PCs. It’s for console people that are Steam-curious. People that bought the Steamdeck but don’t have a PC. I know a few of them.
I’m excited to see an expansion away from MS and Sony and see what improvements Steam makes for Linux. Steam (combined with Win 11) is a big reason why Linux is growing in use and development.
I like Steam as a whole but I do wish the PC market was a little more decentralized.
This is what makes me laugh so much. I had an argument a few years ago with a guy who shat on low-powered PCs because his gaming rig was 100 times more powerful.
And like dude, this shit isn’t for you. The world doesn’t revolve around your needs.
It’s not for people that build their own PCs
Specifically it’s designed to be attractive for people that want a bang for buck, console like experience. and not for the PC enthusiast that build their own system. The whole point is precisely not to compete with self built systems. Why would they? These people are already mainly steam users.
I so so so hope steam is gonna stay the Monopoly they are. They are literally the only company imho that have the humanity to keep gaming fun and affordable.
Yes I know how much they charge for developers to be able to sell. But also if you know what that’s about in truth it’s also not a bad thing.
Hail GabeN
As for Steam staying the monopoly, the biggest thing I worry about is what happens when Gabe dies or retires. I want to believe that the next person will guide them down the same path, but I’ve been burned so many times before.
Gaben has good people around him with similar value system. It will take longer time to dissolve, and hopefully can stay for at least one more generation the way it is.
Bold of you to assume you can build an equivalent PC in terms of price/performance without knowing Steam Machine’s price. Good luck with RAM
Valve already announced it will be priced similarly to a PC you build yourself.
specs wise yes but you will not build a PC in the same form factor for anywhere near that price.
Yeah, the form factor, HDMI-CEC support, and integration with other valve hardware are what really sell it. But it’s not going to be underpriced for the specs, like consoles tend to be.
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Good luck with RAM
RAM costs will likely affect both custom built machines and the steam machine equally.
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There’s a lot of assumptions going around the internet as fact with valves new devices.
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I’m not sure what your point is here exactly, but for one, you’re underestimating the new prices for upper end DDR5 RAM severely; and secondly guess what GPUs come with a bunch of?
cocaine and sex workers?
They should for the prices they’re charging
Depends what you mean by “upper end”, but already 64GB is running for over $600. And it’s almost certainly going to get worse. I wouldn’t be stunned if 32GB tops out at close to $1000 next year.
Typical, “it is not for me, therefore I declare it is stupid and not for anyone!”
It’s ok to not be marketed to. It’s good that a product was not designed for you specifically. “I can build the same PC…” Shhhh, shut up. Go do it, let other people like and enjoy their stuff. You don’t have to buy it if you don’t like it.
They didn’t declare anything. OP was just asking what is the point of it when you can build a cheaper PC that does the same thing. It’s a valid question and others have provided answers to it.
EDIT: You all don’t have to argue with me about this. All I’m saying is OP didn’t declare that this product wasn’t for anyone.
Yeah people are so dumb. You can go to a scrapyard and build a cheap car yourself. Why anyone would buy a car is beyond me.
That’s a false equivalent. I am confident that I could coach my mother through building a computer. I think most mechanics would struggle to assemble an entire car.
This, but unironically
Did you know that I make a mean risotto? It’s so fire. Like, I use all these high class ingredients, a delicious local cheese that tastes like magic. And I can get it to the perfect consistency, and I can do it for relatively cheap. Because I’m doing it myself, labor is not accounted in, I just pay for the ingredients. Thus I can use more expensive ingredients as well.
You know what I also like to do? I like to go out and eat at fancy restaurants with my friends and family. I also eat risotto when I eat out. Their risotto is also just as good as mine. Sometimes better, sometimes not so much. It is always more expensive than cooking myself of course. But you know what I don’t like to do? I don’t like to cook for dozens of people. It is too much labor. However, I can go with a party of 10 or more people and eat in a restaurant. And they will serve us, because they don’t care that there are too many of us. Because we are paying them to cook. I exchange money, for more convenience and less effort. Ain’t that wild?
So, anyways, I’m not talking about food.
In the time you spend making a risotto, you could probably put together a nice PC, and it will probably last a lot longer than a meal. I’m not sure this is a good analogy
Lol, risotto takes like 30 min to make. The hardest part about putting a PC together isn’t the assembly, it’s picking out what parts you want and then buying them all.
For me it’s dealing with my indecision of balancing cost and performance and then the obsessive need to find the best deal for every part I picked.
But yeah my main point was I think you’re overestimating how long risotto takes to cook.
This. Last time I built a PC I spent a week researching all sorts of components only to end up with an incompatible motherboard anyway, having to send it back and order something else.
Building the whole thing took around an hour, not a big deal, but everything else that went into it… It’s like having to start your risotto by planting rice.
Yeah those are solid points. My mistake
No worries, my main criticism was mostly cuisine based. But seriously, if you ever want to impress someone with a home cooked meal, risotto is a really easy but flashy meal. I honestly think it’s one of the easiest ways to cook rice.
There’s more to building a PC than just the putting it together. Reaseach for parts, ordering, waiting for delivery, etc. I know because I have built almost all the computers I’ve ever own. It’s a hobby, not everyone has the same hobbies we do, and that’s OK.
The point is that it is for people who don’t know or even want to know how to build a PC. The only thing they care about is playing games with minimal effort.
So saying you can build a faster PC is a non-argument that makes no sense.
Have they even given a potential price yet?
I have no idea.
I feel like the biggest thing everyone always overlooks is the amount of researchyou need to do to build a PC. Understanding what motherboard, ram, cpu, and gpu will let you play the games you want is not very clear, especially now we have AMD making good cpus and Intel making Gpus.
The naming conventions are all over the place and the specs on what’s best and what’s compatible is opaque at times.
Building the PC is easy, but making sure you didn’t waste your money by buying a motherboard that won’t work on the next generation of chips or you misunderstood the 10+ gpu models distributed by multiple different distributors is also easy.
Yes and no, if you don’t feel like doing a bunch of research pcpartspicker and reddit have all kinds of recommended PC builds at every budget level. You can also pay people to just build a PC for you. Also… pre-built gaming PCs have always been a thing? So I don’t really see the hype tbh.
That’s also research. Someone building a PC for you will also charge for labor, and that’s price parity with a pre-built. The hype is that Valve is front loading a bunch of labor free of MS shitty practices.
Yeah, that’s what I was trying to get across. Either you have to do a lot of research or youre doing a “pre-built” configuration. At that point what Valve is offering is at least equal to other pre-built concepts.
A pre-built gaming solution that comes with guaranteed software support, something that MS doesnt even offer BTW, sounds like a really good deal to me.
I guess, but anyone buying a steam machine is gonna have to research the specs anyways, and more exhaustively, check to see if every game they like is supported. I get why open-source enthusiasts are excited about this project and I am to, but in my opinion the cross-section of people who a) aren’t willing to build their own PC or even research different options and b) are willing to daily drive Linux are pretty slim. Especially when they find out they can’t play BF6.
It’s more likely that Steam leans into the “Steam[Device] Verified ✅/❌” labeling. If anything, that makes navigating the marketplace much easier for a mid-performance buyer. They’ve already done it with steam deck, it’s a good angle to pressure both devs and consumers into their device.
People buying this won’t be “daily driving” their pc in any sense. I think the idea is unlock steam’s library (and marketplace) the massive casual phone/tablet crowd. If I didn’t already have a dedicated gaming PC I would definitely be interested.
Nah I still don’t get it. Windows PC gamers don’t have to think about compatibility at all right now - every major game release is compatible with windows, apart from some Nintendo exclusives. You dont even have to think about it - when a new game is announced I know I will be able to play it on Windows without jumping through any hoops. Even if it’s a simple check mark for every game it’s still more work, and many games are gonna be blocked because of anti-cheat.
I also think that very few casual phone/tablet gamers are going to be purchasing a dedicated Linux gaming machine that isn’t a daily driver computer. Heck, most Americans don’t even have a desktop nowadays. I don’t think there’s a price out for the steam machine yet but we’re talking over $1000 right? Probably more like $1500 once you factor in peripherals? That’s a TON of money for a casual tablet/phone gamer to drop on something that they won’t also be using as a regular computer.
I think windows pc gamers are irrelevant. To me, this is more about getting console players. Particularly where this pc is being advertised for living room tvs. To me this is for getting console gamers into pc gaming, not about getting pc gamers into a different kind of pc gaming. Console players are use to game exclusivity, and where steam hosts a far wider variety of games than any console, the fact you cant play BF6 I think is somewhat irrelevant. Could never play Halo on Playstation, but that never stopped people from buying Playstation. But this strategy hinges on Valve’s ability to put the Steam Machine at a price that console players are comfortable paying.
Edit: when it comes to phone an tablet, yeah I agree. But I also don’t think the Steam Machine is gonna be more than $1000.
We’ll see I suppose. I will add, though, that exclusive games absolutely do drive people to Xbox or Playstation (or Nintendo). Not a deal-breaker for most people, but a factor for some people.
I suspect most people aren’t buying it as a daily driver, but as a gaming device. I don’t use my steamdeck for computing (although toyed with the idea) for example.
There’s a hidden advantage here apart from moving away from Microsoft, or having 1st party controller support.
Game devs will have a precise target to optimize for.
If enough steam machines and steam decks are out there, it simplifies porting software since you have a handful of fixed targets to hit. A studio could easily buy a few of these appliances for testing and development, and know for certain the product will run as intended. It’s a luxury currently enjoyed by consoles, and it really does help their dominance in their respective niches.
This also helps smaller studios since the bare minimum means targeting a known steam platform, rather than pulling machine specs out of thin air and taking their best shot. It’s a much easier problem to solve and takes a lot less time and money.
I think there will always be room for high-end gaming, but as long as you’re “steam machine 2025 compatible” or whatever, you know what you’re going to get.
Yep. My friend is an indie game developer and while his studio’s next release is “Windows only” (and consoles) they are testing to make sure it runs well on the Steam Deck via Proton / will be Verified.
The next release is Windows Only. However, it includes consoles and Steam Deck verified…
Did I read that correctly? What are they skipping, the Commodore 64?
Windows + major consoles, and Steam Deck verified via Proton.
They are not making a Linux build, but they are making sure the Windows build plays nice with Proton. At least that’s how I read that.
Does that mean that I’m left hanging with my Sinclair ZX81? Again?
Windows only (plus this long list of other hardware.)
With the diversity of Steam boxes out there, you can’t really optimize anything.
apart from moving away from Microsoft
Linux.
You’re on Lemmy. I’d appreciate you not using such cuss words
Forgive me father, for I have sinned.
You’re not seeing the big picture. It’s not a box. It’s much more than that.
It’s a cube.
A Weighted Storage Cube, if you will. ( ͡~ ͜ʖ ͡°)
But can it provide emotional support as well?!
That’s a whole new dimension!
The difference between the Steam Machine and an off the shelve gamer pc, is that Valve has created a viable pathway to move away from Microsoft’s dominance in the PC gaming market. This is Valve showing to PC hardware makers that a PC gaming market without Windows is possible. Valve just needs to prove that consumers are willing to buy a Linux gaming machine, so the Steam Machine is the litmus test. Microsoft is Valve’s biggest threat to the survival of their business. Since MS’s anti-consumer behavior will push consumers away from PC gaming. Valve wants to create a PC gaming market where MS’s choke hold has been destroyed. Remember this isn’t Valve’s first attempt, the first Steam Machine was released when Win8 was released where MS tried to push the Windows Store as the default way to download software.
I wish i could upvote this more, PREACH!
I would say that investment in Proton and general Linux support was already driven by the strategical consideration that Microsoft might try to lock-down the PC gaming market.
In that light, the Steam Machine is another part of the same strategy.
But you can build a PC with linux. It’s every bit as possible. Upgradable. Repairable. Functional. Powerful.
You are cheering about yet another proprietary box like a console that affects repairability and how much of it you actually “own” it just because it has linux on it. Yet more “dumbing down” of games to conform to a console spec. You’re blind if you don’t think this will affect games developed to be sold on Steam.
I’m all for linux advancing in gaming, becoming more mainstream, and replacing Windows, but cheering for the demise of PC’s in favor of a proprietary box is a bad idea.
E: this is a very interesting discussion, but I can’t keep replying to the same responses. Lemmy criticizes walled gardens, lack of tech knowledge, anything that isn’t F/OSS, anything that limits ownership of the hardware or the OS…yet here we have people advocating for a proprietary box that has potential to steer game development (yes, toward linux, this is good) and confine it to the steambox’s spec. just because linux good and a semi-benevolent dictatorship is offering it. While I’m not against this console, anything that a BigCorp produces that has the potential to be a walled garden and indirectly constrain development should be met with guarded attitudes and absolutely not cheer the expected demise of PC building or use.
E2: pile it on boys. If lemmy is still here in a decade and Steam does some “bullshit” with the ‘Box I’ll read your complaints as the custom PC market shrinks and gets more expensive thanks to the console-ification of gaming. Consoles aren’t for you per-se. They’re to cheapen hardware, OS, and game development costs and make profits. I’m not against its existence, but leave replacing PC gaming out of your cheering for this box. Good luck.
Most people hit a wall in their life where they get home from work and they just want whatever entertainment system they have to just work. They do not want a side hobby to get to a video game. Linux as it is now will never be the regular. If steam can make a console like experience that a layman can use, they can save PC gaming for all of the gen Z and A folks who only had a phone or console and refuse to learn windows.
In some distros Linux is already at the “just works” stage for gaming at home, at least for desktop PCs.
I’m kinda surprised to read this. As much as Lemmings deride people for not wanting to change to linux, not understanding the basics of PC’s, not willing to learn tech, falling into walled gardens…here you are. Rationalizing for people who don’t want to learn tech and accepting yet another potential walled garden.
How walled is it really though, it’s literally just a linux PC. SteamOS is the (arch-based) distro, and Valve is just a system integrator selling what are effectively pre built systems. Steam Machines are meant to have competitors selling their own systems with their own hardware choices.
This is no different than buying a gaming PC from Cyberpower, Alienware, Asus, etc except that the OS wouldn’t be windows.
Of course, as it stands there are no other competitors but that’s just because we’re in uncharted territory. If the steam machine sells well, then other integrators will make their own versions (like we saw with the Lenovo Legion & ROG Ally).
The idea that this is a “walled garden” when you can install any software you want, swap the OS, install cracked games, etc. is ridiculous. This kind of thinking is exactly why people think there’s too much infighting in the Linux community. Everyone talks about how they want Linux to become more mainstream and to dethrone windows. But when something like this comes around to actually do that, you all complain about how awful it is
Ok, in the context of the original discussion, there is no need to deride PC gaming if all the steambox is is just another PC and no reason to treat it as anything special other than a cheap-ish PC preloaded with linux.
It’s a reasonably priced gaming pc designed for couch use and pre loaded with a couch friendly os. As someone who prefers to game from her couch I can totally see myself weighing it if I was in a position to not miss the money and to take advantage of it. Especially if I think of when I did my last major pc upgrade.
Who is deriding PC gaming? Nothing in the OP or the first comment you replied to is doing that.
We are a very niche group. This product will appeal to a lot of people who aren’t here, but also to some who are. In the end, this will be good for PC gaming as a whole, and it will probably either hurt Microsoft or inspire them to make some serious changes. I’m betting that this also makes people a little more curious about their hardware and software. The steam deck proved to me that leaving windows could be pretty simple and not a downgrade. I’ve been looking to build my own steam machine ever since, and now I might not need to depending on the price.
Your response in a comment chain that derides PC gaming, says it would be good to get away from PC gaming, says people don’t have time or interest in building PCs, people don’t want to understand tech, is “this will be good for PC gaming”?
Ok.
Except that no one derided PC gaming. They’re deriding Microsoft.
You’re letting perfect be the enemy of good.
It is a realization of the populace. If most people wanted the full control that Linux provides, Windows would have died years ago.
Consumer Linux isn’t going to be a thing until it gets packaged neatly as a product to consume.
I’ve built cars and motorcycles. It’s far easier to just buy a car or motorcycle.
That isn’t what the context of the discussion is about. Please read my edit and other responses.
The reason you are being piled on is because Steam, the Steam deck, and most likely both the Frame and the Steam machine, are NOT walled gardens. It is not a console. Valve actively encourages people to use the hardware wherever and however you want, install EPIC, install Heroic, install GOG games, do whatever you want. You can buy a Steam Deck and play only and exclusively pirated games, and Valve won’t stop you, they can’t stop you, because it is just a computer. And it is open, and it is yours. This goes completely against all proprietary software and hardware tenets, and it is incompatible with your argument.
It is a big corporation, and it is a benevolent dictatorship. But Valve is not, and it does not try to behave like a monopoly, it is not proprietary (most of the development work on gaming in Linux is done under FOSS licenses), and it is not a walled garden.
Exactly. It’s just a pre-built, nothing more. Really wouldn’t be surprised if someone tries to run MacOS on the thing
Go to anyone who mainly game either on consoles or a non-hand-built computer this. They won’t do it, because it requires they spend a couple dozen hours researching not only parts but also distros, which is something they know they already don’t care about. I think you might be underestimating the expertise you have in this subject by having it as a hobby if you think that’s easy.
yet another proprietary box like a console that affects repairability and how much of it you actually “own” it just because it has linux on it
Even if I assume the steam hardware is as proprietary as any other random piece of hardware (don’t think that’s true), the reality is that I easily trust Valve 2-10x more in this regard than a Sony / Nintendo / whatever prebuilt to actually deliver a product that doesn’t ship my data off to an advertiser and let’s me replace the ssd without hardlocking itself. The Steam Deck has already done a better on this.
The existence of the Steam Machine does not stop people from building their own Linux gaming box. The Steam Machine just proves that it is possible to do so. Like many people’s first PC was a pre built machine and then their subsequent machines were all custom builds. The Steam Machine can do the same for Linux PCs.
We have to start somewhere. People can buy this box that just works and dip there toes into the linux environment and learn how things operate. When they hit the limits of the proprietary box they will be more comfortable upgrading to a PC of their own running a Linux OS. Most people don’t want to deal with all the hangups that come with trying to switch to Linux. The only reason I’m doing it is because the hangups that come from Windows are reaching the tipping point and I’m good with computers.
For the average PC user, the (modern) Steam Machine is a mediocre 3rd-party prebuilt system with the interesting quirk of being Linux native with no Microsoft licensing.
For the average gamer, the Steam Machine is a console-like experience to a game library stretching back to nearly the dawn of gaming with little worry that the next release will have you purchasing your favorite titles again.
For the average game developer, the new lineup is excellent reference hardware. Having something real to target helps combat scope creep, whereby a game has fancy features that look nice until you realize the game only runs properly on a $15K machine for example.
For Valve, they are in a life or death battle to sever their dependency on Microsoft. Their hardware is mostly an excuse to build out their platform capabilities
- The 2013 Steam Machine coincided with releasing a Linux native version of their client.
- The OG Steam controller encourages devs to implement their Steam Input virtual control package.
- The Steam Link upgraded their remote play capabilities.
- The Steam Deck coincided with the deployment of Proton, so they can make their back-catalog run outside windows on any x86_64 machine. It also served as a testbed for improving their power efficiency and standby mode operations.
- With the Steam Frame, they’re implementing both FEX and Lepton:
- FEX runs x86_64 games on ARM devices (meaning that it can run any windows game on any average smartphone/tablet/etc if it’s powerful enough)
- Lepton is based on Waydroid to run Android apps on Linux, allowing game developers for Android and the Quest to easily import their titles into the Steam platform
- The Box is an important accessory to the Frame, as the headset is going to be lightweight system comparatively.
I don’t get it. We don’t know how much it will cost so how could anyone claim they can build one cheaper? Have you seen the cost of memory lately?
It’s Valves latest attempt to squeeze the already brainwashed PC G*mers of their cash.
This isn’t even their first attempt. Remember the 2015 disaster, 7 months before it was dropped.
The only difference this time is the Steam logo. Printed on the box like a trigger phrase to the brainwashed masses.
Lord GabeN needs to buy more Aston Martin Valkyries and mega yachts. I guess sales on unfinished games and the LootBox gambling economy have slowed down.
“bUiLD mY oWN Pc”
in this economy???
No, the interesting part is not that Valve is releasing a box.
The interesting part is that they are releasing a desktop platform linux OS that is basically a commitment from the largest and most integrous digital distribution platform in the world that has an unshakable chokehold on gaming, past, present, and future. It’s a declaration of war upon Microsoft, in a time in society where the people also desperately need a champion for home computing.
The interesting part is Valve is positioning themselves to potentially do an incredible amount of good for a lot of people fed up with publicly traded companies min-maxing extraction of money and forced reliance upon inferior service and software.
It’s not a box with steam on it. It’s an OS option for those of us that want to game in peace.
I imagined brave men and women humming The Impossible Dream in the background while reading your post.
Even with the most cynical point of view making gaming more viable on linux is a profitable option for valve, because microsoft most likely wants to get a piece of the game store market too, and they have the means to fight unfairly
The end result is good either way I guess
Both can be interesting in different ways
Not everybody knows how to build a PC or how to install Steam OS on it. Here we also get support from the vendor so we know everything should work fine with the components.
I think it is a great idea! If you dont like it, then there is no downside, just don’t buy it.
I have only ever built my own PCs. My i9, 4020 is sitting in my detached garage right now. And because I’m too lazy to brave the elements to walk out there in the evenings, I game far less than I used to. So I’m thinking about grabbing a steambox to hook up to the basement TV, because it’ll be simple. I will plug it in and it will (ostensibly) just work. No farting around.
Exactly. I turned my gaming rig into a hypervisor, and if I wasn’t dead set on getting Sunshine or Wolf running in Proxmox, I’d be eyeing the Steam Machine.
I don’t know what those things are!
A hypervisor is an OS that exists to run virtual machines. VMWare’s ESXi and Microsoft’s Hyper-V are the more well known ones.
Sunshine is an application that lets you stream games from your computer to Moonlight, kind of like SteamLink.
Wolf is Sunshine, but in a docker container that lets you create multiple profiles that run independently of each other (for example multiple Steam accounts streaming games from one computer simultaneously).
Appreciate that, thank you.
You don’t have to inherently know how to build a PC, but there are step by step guides on the internet. 25 years ago I used a guide from https://www.tomshardware.com/ to build my first PC. Nowadays it’s even easier, you can go to https://pcpartpicker.com/ and filter the builds according to your budget and specific requirements.
Why are you insisting people add an other hobby to their already full lives?
Just so they can get a slightly better deal?
People don’t care, get over it.
I built my first PC in 2009. You’re right that it isn’t very hard, especially now with resources like what you linked plus videos on YouTube. But not everybody is interested in tinkering like that. There’s research to be done to even know what half this shit means. Your average gamer hasn’t built a PC and doesn’t know AMD from Intel. Younger people these days tend to expect something quick and easy, so they’ll be more likely to buy something prebuilt. People 35ish+ these days tend to be too busy working multiple jobs and/or school and/or managing homes, so they’ll be more likely to buy something that just works when they get an hour to spare.
It’s getting to be exceedingly rare for a person to have the knowledge necessary AND time AND money to build and troubleshoot a modern PC.
As somebody who probably could do it, I might still just buy a steam machine. Because I don’t need cutting edge shit and I just want to sip on whiskey and relax, not have yet another fucking project on my hands. My laptop is old and dying, and I’m looking for a reason to not buy a PS6. This would cover both.
I’ve been building my own PCs since the 90s. I would not expect anyone to be able to or want to, build their own computers. It is a hobby, I invest countless hours and money into this hobby. I do not expect others to dedicate as much resources to a hobby as I do.
I don’t want a solution, I want to be mad! Ten minutes of searching for a guide a ten year old could follow? Who do you think I am???
You can find a ps5/iphone repair dude/shop anywhere, pc isnt as accesible, this may make it easier to mantain them longterm, the ideal prebuilt
It looks like you accidentally made your post in the larger header font. If you remove the hyphen at the end, it’ll be normal size again.
Either ppl hated the size or don’t see how it’d be more easily repairable for ppl not living in major cities, like my city doesn’t have a single tech or pc store outside of bestbuy, walmart, target, etc. I dream of microcenter coming here. My ps5 on the other hand, I got 30 repair shops 5 ft away
thanks
“I can build a better PC For less money.”
How would you know? They literally haven’t announced a price, yet.
EDIT: The only official word we’ve had on pricing is that it will be priced “like a PC”. Their stated reasoning is that because it’s a general purpose PC on an open platform, making margin back on games isn’t a guarantee.
If they priced it too low, there would be nothing stopping volume purchasers (like companies) buying them all up at scale because it’s the best compute / $ and then not using them for actually playing games.
Step 1: already have a better PC
I think everybody should be happy then. Imagine you have a good PC, then you don’t have to buy the steam machine and yet you can still buy your games on steam and use the steam controller on it.
Why are people upset?
“I can build a better computer for cheaper” great then just do it and be happy you’re not wasting money.
No one is forcing y’all to buy the steam machine.
And it’s that small and capable?
“Better” would imply those things yes
Nice! Do you have any specs or pictures? I’d be really interested.
For real. I know for a fact that Valve can buy hardware for less than any of us can. Its just a question of how much markup they want to slap on this, but it could easily be cheaper than any of us could build an equivalent.
They just saw one of those predict (absolutely horrific because they don’t even count companies partnerships, prices being different for companies vs common folks etc etc)
Probably won’t be cheaper than a PC. Otherwise people are just going to buy it just for cheap compute.
As long as it’s not sold at a loss, that’s not a problem for Valve.
And if they want to they can sell it like they did initially with the Steam Deck, one purchase per Steam account.I’ve heard this so many times. I don’t think so. It’s still going to be more expensive than a cheap corporate desktop that can’t play games, and it’s not going to be that good for compute compared to powerful datacenter hardware. I’m assuming some YouTube said this and everyone is repeating it, but I don’t think it makes sense. The comparison is always made the the PS3, but it’s a very different time and hardware is dramatically different.
It’s a safe bet that this will be true. It’ll be priced like a prebuilt PC which are always a little more expensive than building yourself
I kinda think the controllers and size justify a slight premium over building as well though. At least in this stage (mid 40s) of my life.
I’m riding into my fifties - and given recent pricing ridiculousness with video cards and now ram, my desire to build my own is significantly less. No cost savings and then adding the time investment starts to become less attractive as years go by. I was looking forward in the next year or two to upgrade my circa 2020 build. I’ve held off due to abhorrent video card pricing - Love me some games but I’ve been playing more single player non-demanding games (metroidvania types).
Lol prebuilts were actually cheaper when GPU prices skyrocketed and it may happen again thanks to RAM prices
Prebuilts are often cheaper due to the manufacturers selling bloatet crap as “preinstalled OEM Windows” where they get paid to include a bunch of unnecessary software into their images. That way, they can sell their PCs for cheaper while still making a profit.
They also get better parts prices than consumers if they buy bulk.
So things you can easily remove by resetting Windows, ok got it.
Yes, that has been the conventional wisdom for the last 20 or so years.
I think the argument is the Steam Machine won’t get that advantage because it’s running Linux out-of-the-box. There’s still some stuff that could be bundled, but I expect it not to do so for money. I don’t think the Deck does.
There have been multiple points in history where stripping a pre-built for parts was cheaper than buying those parts individually. Honestly, that is probably the case more often than not because they get the parts cheaper.
One thing to note is that the GPU that Valve is using is apparently a custom one that was created for a cancelled Microsoft project or something, and so Valve is probably getting a better deal on it than we ever could because they’re the only ones buying it off the manufacturer.
But regardless, anybody who is willing to build their own PC is not the target market for Valve. The target market is the other 80% of Steam users and potentially console players. A coworker of mine was just talking the other day about a friend of theirs who is replacing their PS4 because Sony is shutting down the PS4 servers, and they were telling them to wait and get the Steam Machine and get out from under Sony’s thumb.
