My wife likes to ride a bike, a lot.
The more you get into it, the more expensive it gets.
No those bikes and accessories aren’t cheap. That thing getting stolen is a serious hit.
Simple general store ones are cheap, dedicated sports store ones are far from cheap.
Bicycles are great force multipliers, but legs are true symbol of freedom of movement.
More versatile, almost everyone already have those, already using those is the maintenance required to maintain those.
Though yeah i absolutely can’t understand how cars became a symbol of freedom.
Those are literally like a ball and chain around your legs.
The cost of maintenance, car itself and fuel, stress from said fuel price and then getting to sit in a traffic jam overwhelming majority of the time, while trying to memorize huge amount of road rules that many just ignore and which can result in death.
Yeah sure racetrack driving might be nice or going somewhere really remote, but that’s so rare as to be a statistical anomaly, overwhelming majority of the time it’s basic everyday driving.
Underrated point. Someone always brings up the cost of bikes in these threads and it’s silly. Sure, some hard core cyclists will put $20k into the hobby, but it’s not at all necessary.
I’ve got maybe $1200 in my total set up, and I could have done it far cheaper if I’d been picky about shopping sales and buying used.
The bike was around $750 new, $80 for an ergonomic saddle (saves on padded shorts, but YMMV), $60 for a helmet that fits well, $100 for pedals with toe clips so I can wear street shoes, and a few accessories here and there.
I put in 30-50 miles a week on average and I’ve had the bike for better than 2 years with no major mechanical issues. I don’t know where that puts me in terms of milage over the average cyclist, but I have a great time and get plenty of exercise without breaking the bank.
I used to ride a mid to high range Fuji (a semi permement loan) with no toe clips or any aditional gear, and in street clothes. At my peak riding with that bike, I was doing 90 miles a week (to and from work only. I was probably doing more outside of work travel). Like once a year the tubes would blow out, that was the only cost. The bike was also not rated for my hieght. To boot, I was at least three inches too short for it, and would use road curbs to mount and dismount lol. Ya couldnt stop me from riding.
god I miss it. I just got my bike working again, an REI mountain bike, and I like it, but have no where to go on it, I just lap my neighborhood a couple times a week. I miss the city in this way. I used to go to the store with a back pack, put my shopping on my back, ride to friends houses, do a 20mile trip with a mapquest printouts, get lost, find my way. So much fun. I did everything on my bike for close to ten years. It was liberating not needing gas money, and by god was I fit
As a note about the “symbology of freedom” when it comes to cars it I think comes down to American centric shit again. When I lived in small town USA where there is nothing to do but meth and everyone knows everyone else’s business the dream of packing your shit in a backpack and getting into the car and driving 4 hours away feels like freedom. You can go to a city or town and get away from it all.
Now you can do the same in Europe on a train but that won’t sell cars so…
You can even see it in American car ads. There are two kinds of cars - the commuter, which focuses on luxury and style, and the “get away from your life” car, the SUVs you stick your camping gear in and go to the middle of nowhere to get away from your shitty life and experience nature in.
Cars are a symbol of freedom because there is no transportation options, so not having one feels like prison
When I lived in small town USA where there is nothing to do but meth and everyone knows everyone else’s business the dream of packing your shit in a backpack and getting into the car and driving 4 hours away feels like freedom. You can go to a city or town and get away from it all.
That’s mainly because they quit running passenger service on those train tracks running through town 50 years ago.
Like most any hobby, you can spend as much on it as you like. But the bike coop in your city will probably sell a perfectly-serviceable used commuter to you on a need-based sliding scale all the way down to $20, if not totally free.
As for legs… They’re nice, but I’ve ridden my bicycle 110+ miles in like 8 hours. That’s a massive quantitative difference, and a huge impact on quality of life for someone who needs to get around.
Yep. Even the actual race bikes being used in the Tour de France right now are only $10k or so. The only sports car that little cash will get you is a used Miata.
Because distance. Bikes makes total sense in cities or just anywhere where there is a dense enough population that you can do all you want inside a 5km-10kkm area, but for a lot of north america, Australia, etc the freedom comes from being able to take any road you like and see where it ends up
@Jarix@Shellofbiomatter The overwhelming majority of trips aren’t aimless wandering in search of freedom, they’re utilitarian trips to the grocery store, library, a friend’s house, your kids’ school, etc. The percentage of people in sprawly countries who truly live too far away from daily necessities to get there by bicycle if the roads were designed for safety and comfort is far too small to justify adopting standards that force even cities to make their streets bike-unfriendly.
Just responding to why cars are seen as the vehicle of freedom.
In all things people rarely, if ever, maximize what they COULD do.
And we can disagree with those people who view it that way if we want to frame it, but I can’t visit my friends in the city by riding a bike. When I do hang with friends I’ve often gone out of my way to give people rides because it’s much better for them to use my offer of a lift home than it is to use public transit or their own mobility.
My main point though is distance is the determining factor in this equation.
Ok, then why isn’t the bullet train the symbol of freedom? You can visit friends much further away than a car can. How about motorcycles? You can visit your friends even if there’s insane traffic or the road is out.
I think cars being the symbol of freedom is unrelated to any actual utility, rather it seems based on a story advertisers tell about a car offering you control.
The more into get you it, the more expensive it gets. No those bikes and accessories aren’t cheap.
She’s ‘getting into it’ wrong.
My hot take of the day: Unless you’re making up for the cost of it by winning money at competitive events, you have no business even thinking about any bike that costs more than $600. And for the vast majority of people, $600 is the luxury option – a $200 used bike (with a bit of maintenance) will do everything you could ever ask it to.
Sincerely, someone who does most of his commuting on a $20 used bike from the 90’s. (It’s a great feeling of power, overtaking a $1500 ebike on your $20 steel frame 90’s cruiser.)
Everyone’s finances are different, your economic guardrails won’t necessarily make sense for someone else. I’ve built plenty of commuters that have rolled out the door of my local coop for < $50 and I put love into every single one of them, every single one of them was (Mostly) solid. But I also have a $3.5K dream build that mostly just hangs on my wall made from vintage new-on-shelf parts, an ode to late-90s / early-00s roadie aesthetics.
I do agree, but in her defense she is making full use of it and over time has progressed from the basic commuter to more advanced bikes which have had significant increase to speed and enjoyability/comfort of the ride. Up until now she has already rode 5k km just this year, planning to finish this year with 10k km.
For everyone else I do agree and have a basic commuter that I literally got from a trash pile through her connections to local biking community.
Yeah I would generally agree to that. I got mine for £600 and admit it’s more than I really needed. But it’s a pretty nice bike and I use it a lot. It was the cheaper model from the more expensive brand so my thinking was it’s probably a pretty good frame and I can replace other parts as I go.
Replaced the tyres after about 2 years, new ones cost like twice as much but marathon plus touring tyres should last far longer and are much more puncture resistant.
![[meme] Anon likes bikes](https://files.ikt.id.au/aqdemc.webp){kind=link}
My wife likes to ride a bike, a lot. The more you get into it, the more expensive it gets. No those bikes and accessories aren’t cheap. That thing getting stolen is a serious hit.
Simple general store ones are cheap, dedicated sports store ones are far from cheap.
Bicycles are great force multipliers, but legs are true symbol of freedom of movement. More versatile, almost everyone already have those, already using those is the maintenance required to maintain those.
Though yeah i absolutely can’t understand how cars became a symbol of freedom. Those are literally like a ball and chain around your legs.
The cost of maintenance, car itself and fuel, stress from said fuel price and then getting to sit in a traffic jam overwhelming majority of the time, while trying to memorize huge amount of road rules that many just ignore and which can result in death.
Yeah sure racetrack driving might be nice or going somewhere really remote, but that’s so rare as to be a statistical anomaly, overwhelming majority of the time it’s basic everyday driving.
You can cycle a lot without getting into racing bikes though.
Walking you are going to want shoes. Shoes wear through and actually cost more than a decent regular bike per km.
Underrated point. Someone always brings up the cost of bikes in these threads and it’s silly. Sure, some hard core cyclists will put $20k into the hobby, but it’s not at all necessary.
I’ve got maybe $1200 in my total set up, and I could have done it far cheaper if I’d been picky about shopping sales and buying used.
The bike was around $750 new, $80 for an ergonomic saddle (saves on padded shorts, but YMMV), $60 for a helmet that fits well, $100 for pedals with toe clips so I can wear street shoes, and a few accessories here and there.
I put in 30-50 miles a week on average and I’ve had the bike for better than 2 years with no major mechanical issues. I don’t know where that puts me in terms of milage over the average cyclist, but I have a great time and get plenty of exercise without breaking the bank.
I used to ride a mid to high range Fuji (a semi permement loan) with no toe clips or any aditional gear, and in street clothes. At my peak riding with that bike, I was doing 90 miles a week (to and from work only. I was probably doing more outside of work travel). Like once a year the tubes would blow out, that was the only cost. The bike was also not rated for my hieght. To boot, I was at least three inches too short for it, and would use road curbs to mount and dismount lol. Ya couldnt stop me from riding.
god I miss it. I just got my bike working again, an REI mountain bike, and I like it, but have no where to go on it, I just lap my neighborhood a couple times a week. I miss the city in this way. I used to go to the store with a back pack, put my shopping on my back, ride to friends houses, do a 20mile trip with a mapquest printouts, get lost, find my way. So much fun. I did everything on my bike for close to ten years. It was liberating not needing gas money, and by god was I fit
As a note about the “symbology of freedom” when it comes to cars it I think comes down to American centric shit again. When I lived in small town USA where there is nothing to do but meth and everyone knows everyone else’s business the dream of packing your shit in a backpack and getting into the car and driving 4 hours away feels like freedom. You can go to a city or town and get away from it all.
Now you can do the same in Europe on a train but that won’t sell cars so…
You can even see it in American car ads. There are two kinds of cars - the commuter, which focuses on luxury and style, and the “get away from your life” car, the SUVs you stick your camping gear in and go to the middle of nowhere to get away from your shitty life and experience nature in.
Cars are a symbol of freedom because there is no transportation options, so not having one feels like prison
That’s mainly because they quit running passenger service on those train tracks running through town 50 years ago.
Fair, from that perspective it does make sense.
Like most any hobby, you can spend as much on it as you like. But the bike coop in your city will probably sell a perfectly-serviceable used commuter to you on a need-based sliding scale all the way down to $20, if not totally free.
As for legs… They’re nice, but I’ve ridden my bicycle 110+ miles in like 8 hours. That’s a massive quantitative difference, and a huge impact on quality of life for someone who needs to get around.
I do agree and I did got my own bike for free from trash pile through her connections to local biking community.
But she is making full use of the specialized equipment and bikes so i will not fault her for doing it.
A sports car is also not cheap.
Yep. Even the actual race bikes being used in the Tour de France right now are only $10k or so. The only sports car that little cash will get you is a used Miata.
I paid the same for my pretty basic commuter bicycle and my literal motorcycle.
Its baffling how expensive even slightly nice bicycles are.
Because distance. Bikes makes total sense in cities or just anywhere where there is a dense enough population that you can do all you want inside a 5km-10kkm area, but for a lot of north america, Australia, etc the freedom comes from being able to take any road you like and see where it ends up
I hundered percent did this on my bike. Ive done it in a car, but you can “take a road and see where it goes” on a bike.
@Jarix @Shellofbiomatter The overwhelming majority of trips aren’t aimless wandering in search of freedom, they’re utilitarian trips to the grocery store, library, a friend’s house, your kids’ school, etc. The percentage of people in sprawly countries who truly live too far away from daily necessities to get there by bicycle if the roads were designed for safety and comfort is far too small to justify adopting standards that force even cities to make their streets bike-unfriendly.
Just responding to why cars are seen as the vehicle of freedom.
In all things people rarely, if ever, maximize what they COULD do.
And we can disagree with those people who view it that way if we want to frame it, but I can’t visit my friends in the city by riding a bike. When I do hang with friends I’ve often gone out of my way to give people rides because it’s much better for them to use my offer of a lift home than it is to use public transit or their own mobility.
My main point though is distance is the determining factor in this equation.
Ok, then why isn’t the bullet train the symbol of freedom? You can visit friends much further away than a car can. How about motorcycles? You can visit your friends even if there’s insane traffic or the road is out.
I think cars being the symbol of freedom is unrelated to any actual utility, rather it seems based on a story advertisers tell about a car offering you control.
Because that’s a track that can’t go off the beaten path…
Neither can your car, it can only go where roads go, when traffic permits.
She’s ‘getting into it’ wrong.
My hot take of the day: Unless you’re making up for the cost of it by winning money at competitive events, you have no business even thinking about any bike that costs more than $600. And for the vast majority of people, $600 is the luxury option – a $200 used bike (with a bit of maintenance) will do everything you could ever ask it to.
Sincerely, someone who does most of his commuting on a $20 used bike from the 90’s. (It’s a great feeling of power, overtaking a $1500 ebike on your $20 steel frame 90’s cruiser.)
Everyone’s finances are different, your economic guardrails won’t necessarily make sense for someone else. I’ve built plenty of commuters that have rolled out the door of my local coop for < $50 and I put love into every single one of them, every single one of them was (Mostly) solid. But I also have a $3.5K dream build that mostly just hangs on my wall made from vintage new-on-shelf parts, an ode to late-90s / early-00s roadie aesthetics.
I do agree, but in her defense she is making full use of it and over time has progressed from the basic commuter to more advanced bikes which have had significant increase to speed and enjoyability/comfort of the ride. Up until now she has already rode 5k km just this year, planning to finish this year with 10k km.
For everyone else I do agree and have a basic commuter that I literally got from a trash pile through her connections to local biking community.
Yeah I would generally agree to that. I got mine for £600 and admit it’s more than I really needed. But it’s a pretty nice bike and I use it a lot. It was the cheaper model from the more expensive brand so my thinking was it’s probably a pretty good frame and I can replace other parts as I go.
Replaced the tyres after about 2 years, new ones cost like twice as much but marathon plus touring tyres should last far longer and are much more puncture resistant.