not talking about historical CCP, I’m talking about the CCP of today. Today it is dominated by xenophobic misogynistic billionaires. Xi is President for life because of the belief that only a strongman can protect China from the evil foreigners and run the economy (which is a capitalist economy).

So the CCP was communist at one point and is now fascist even though Mao also served the same role…?

They have a mixed economy, that’s not really up for debate. It’s not purely capitalistic and it’s not completely centralized and planned. Though a lot of the complaints I see in this sub tend to be about the states undue influence over the economic system, which would indicate that there is a lot of centralized control.

Labour unions are illegal in China, workers are oppressed. No matter the CCP may have been in the past, it is a fascist party today.

Western styled independent labour unions are, but every worker belongs to a centralized workers union. Much in the same way the USSR operated their labour representation.

Could working conditions improve in modern China…? Yes, absolutely. Have they vastly improved over the last few decades…? Yes, absolutely.

actually have a science degree. Political “science” was not a credit towards my degree, it’s in the humanities category. They call it “science” to try to give it legitimacy, but there really isn’t a whole lot of science going on there.

So do I… There’s a difference between soft sciences and hard sciences. The point is to study the topic in a scientific manor. The difference being how quantitative the data you are working with is.

They have tenure so continue to have lectures about how “real communism” has never been tried (google the “no true scotsman” fallacy) and a lot of apologism over the atrocities committed by communist regimes.

That appears to be a stawman argument, I don’t think I’ve ever heard an actual professor make that claim. Some might claim communism has never been achieved, but I’d doubt they claim it’s never been attempted. And again, I think you’d be hard pressed to find a professor who claimed a communist government never participated with or enacted an atrocity. Those who make that claim are simply wrong and do not represent the entirety of a political ideology.

You’re not supposed to take those poli sci classes seriously, it’s just an easy credit if you don’t challenge anything the old commie profs say.

Lol, how many old commie political science professors do you think there are in the west…? And yes, you should take every class in college seriously. That claim speaks a lot more about you and your education than anything I could say.

Why not? You have a Pavlovian response to the phrase “late stage capitalism” so I guess late stage communism isn’t something that’s part of your conditioning.

Because it doesn’t make any logical sense? We have achieved the goals set forth in capitalist theory, we’ve never seen a socialist government actually achieve there theoretical end goal. You could say faultering communism, or failing communist, but not late stage.

Multiple communist regimes have failed, so if we’re actually doing real political science (and not just going along with whatever the commie prof says) it would be something that would be studied and the patterns could be identified.

And if you would have said China is failing to achieve communism, it would be open to debate. To say that it’s “late stage” is just nonsensical.

while the system that hasn’t failed is the one you assume must inevitably fail.

Lol, what exactlyis your criteria for assessing if a capitalistic nation has failed?

We know that central planning doesn’t work for a developed economy (it’s too complex for a small group of people to manage), communist regimes have to allow some degree of economic freedom so the economy can function.

It’s almost like political theory eveolves over time… Where exactly does it say that socialist and communist countries have to maintain a strict command economy?

Increased economic freedom results in ideas spreading, which means there’s a greater pressure for political freedom on the ruling regime. Hardliners don’t want this (it’s a threat to their power) coups and crackdowns start occurring.

And what about a “free market” inherently makes “ideas” spread?

But sure, go on pretending that communism is super successful and go along with a religious-like prophecy of “late stage capitalism” that doesn’t stand up to scrutiny

Late stage capitalism describes a measurable effect created by the need for exponential growth. At a certain point growth is dictated by things like population and market forces. It’s when you hit a point where innovation and resources availability fail to meet growth demand, so the only way to achieve that growth is by monopolization, conglomeration, and reduction of labour.

Like why are we now in “late stage capitalism” now but we weren’t in the 1930s? Why did the policies implemented to get out of the Great Depression work, and why wouldn’t they work now?

I would argue that we were experiencing a form of late stage capitalism in the 1930s and the only way we got out of it was by centralizing more power to the government and then implementing socialist policy.

John Maynard Keynes > Karl Marx. Marx identified some real problems with capitalism, Keynes found a solution to those problems.

Lol, and that’s why everyone is doing so great now… Tell me, how exactly did keynes find a way to ensure constant growth in a world with limited resources?

The Marxist solution failed, the Keynesian solution succeeded. It’s obvious to anyone that understands anything about economics. Communism is obsolete, it only exists now as a rationalization for authoritarianism.

If you are claiming that communism failed because one nation dissolved it’s government, then why does that not apply to capitalist governments who have done the same?

The reason a lot of leftist countries are more authoritarian than some liberal ones is because they are aware of how fascism and other reactionary movements work. There is a reason why every actual fascist government has reared itself from a failing liberal government. Fascism was developed to take advantage of schisms within liberal societies to create opportunities for power. You should really read the death of democracy by Benjamin Hett. Don’t worry he is a liberal and advocates for liberalism in the book. But he does have a good grasp on the development of fascism and how it differs from other forms of government.