On the one hand, I think it is true that a certain kind of skill is required to read and manipulate people - the same kind of skill a conman or used car salesman needs to do their work, and that kind of skill obviously doesn’t need knowledge of quantum physics or even a rudimentary understanding of how the world in general works.
On the other hand, one shouldn’t give people like Trump, Berlusconi and Idi Amin too much credit. They ended up where they did largely due to historical happenstance, and millions of other conmen and used car salespeople stayed small-time.
Putin wasn’t the only KGB colonel before he became the president of Russia. He had peers and were given equal footing as him. But he had proven to be more cunning and ruthless than them so he gained power. Those low level conning salesmen you mentioned, they probably weren’t savvy enough. However, if they had been as savvy as the most successful con salesman, Elon Musk, then their fates would have been different otherwise.
There are those who started from the bottom, quite literally. Stalin was a pure thug who robbed banks for the Bolsheviks. He was also ridiculed for being intellectually inferior on the communist theory, especially by Lenin. And well, who lived until the ripe old age of 70, while the other was murdered in cold blood with an icepick?
I neglected to mention before and what I’m trying to say now, is to not underestimate the opponent. Once the person underestimates the opponent, is when that person loses. It’s the basic of art of war. I’m gonna be blunt, who is dumber? The person whose social security details were robbed in broad daylight, and that data is sold and fed to the private digital surveillance to train AI? It’s certainly not the dumb ketamine addicted CEO of a conglomerate of grifting companies, nor the dumb orange president who could push the red button at any notice. To think you and I are not dumb, whose details were already put into surveillance AI, are wishful thinking and coping.
Putin wasn’t the only KGB colonel before he became the president of Russia. He had peers and were given equal footing as him. But he had proven to be more cunning and ruthless than them so he gained power.
Putin isn’t in the category I mentioned. Even so, Putin rapidly rose up the political ranks and in the chaos of the later Yeltsin presidency ended up prime minister largely by chance.
Those low level conning salesmen you mentioned, they probably weren’t savvy enough.
The numbers don’t add up. Suppose there are a million savvy conmen. How can they all become major players on the international business and political scene? There just aren’t enough of those positions.
However, if they had been as savvy as the most successful con salesman, Elon Musk, then their fates would have been different otherwise.
Elon Musk started with a heap of money (as did Trump), in an oligarchic system heavily favouring those with money.
And well, who lived until the ripe old age of 70, while the other was murdered in cold blood with an icepick?
Not Lenin, who died of an unknown illness. I think you mean Trotsky.
Never underestimate the opposition.
My opposition, personally? That would be practically all politicians, ideologically, to some degree or other. I am not a member of any political organization.
I used Putin as example because any sleazy jobs require the same Machiavellian instincts as with being a devious salesman. Not every dodgy salesman becomes millionaire or CEO with political leverage, because they may either happy with their gains or not ambitious enough and comfortable to remain in their stations. However, those ambitious enough beat their competition with ruthless efficiency. I’m sure there are hundreds of millionaires and billionaires who started as lowly deceptive salesman, but we just haven’t heard of them because they’re not publicly prominent.
Going back to Putin, it wasn’t really a chance on how he came to power. He was a colonel of one of the most feared spy agencies. I mean, what would you do with that much access to power if you are as ambitious as Putin? Sure, luck and happenstance also play key roles, but luck is a residue of preparation. Knowing how to take advantage of those lucky opportunities to forward own’s agenda takes certain skills to mobilise and pull the necessary levers.
A lot of people of dismiss the likes of Musk and Trump’s ability on how they got into power as being the result of being silver spooned. But people conveniently forget that it still requires knowledge, skills and experience to maintain the high status. Plenty of famous intergenerational wealthy families eventually lose their status because their descendants squander the fortunes handed to them. If Trump and Musk are stupid, they would be poor and not have gotten to the White House. So, they still have some intelligence but not about being empathetic.
I’m talking about in general on the anti-Trump camp as underestimating his stupidity. Authoritarian bodies eventually fall because of corruption and stupidity, but that’s not what is happening at the moment. The Trumpian America is just getting started and him and his cronies are smart enough on how to gain power and secure it. You may not be politically active, but they know already that you’re possibly anti-Trump because they took your social security details and other public records, and fed it into their surveillance system. Sorry to be so gloomy but I’m gonna be frank, they’re not stupid for having just robbed you, a nobody Lemmy while they are the ones in charge and spying on you.
I don’t know, I came from a former dictator run country and know how to call a spade a spade. So I will be blunt say Americans are still making heads or tails, on whether or not they are in a fascist state, because they never experienced what dictatorship is before. Constantly calling authoritarians stupid, while you and I are relying on supply chain run by them and could pressure us to conform, maybe we’re the stupid ones. Calling them stupid is coping for not accepting the fact that the inferiors outwitted us and manipulating our means of living.
This type of thinking is known as the just-world fallacy. It’s very tempting, because people prefer to believe that things happen “for a reason” and not just randomly. Yet there is no basis in reality for this type of thinking. Trump is stupid, and many of his comments can’t be explained by mere showmanship and playing to his base. The only reasonable explanation for forest raking, or negative GDP, or look, having nuclear etc. etc. is that he is a clueless idiot, and he is.
Musk is evil, and certainly no genius, but also not stupid. He has an undergraduate degree in physics, whereas Trump merely has an MBA of negligible academic standard, which certifies basic literacy at best.
The existence of markets naturally leads to an upward flow of capital from the have-nots to the haves. One of the interesting things researchers have found is that simulations with identical agents (i.e. all equally smart) and simple market mechanics lead to the emergence of extreme inequality. You can find the details in the economic literature if you’re interested.
Plenty of famous intergenerational wealthy families eventually lose their status because their descendants squander the fortunes handed to them.
As it happens, Trump did squander his inheritance, but managed to claw back his fortune, first by money laundering for Russian mobsters, then by using his political office for personal gain. Fake it until you make it very much applies here.
You may not be politically active, but they know already that you’re possibly anti-Trump because they took your social security details and other public records, and fed it into their surveillance system.
Well, call me naïve, but they are pretty cautious around this kind of stuff in Germany, I doubt the US government has access to these kinds of records.
Well like I said, Trump is stupid administratively, but he’s a good conman. Einstein might be good at physics, but he is the last person you would ask on ecology. So to repeat what I said in my original comment: there is no one type of intelligence. It’s not “just world” fallacy, one could argue that it’s “unjust world” fallacy for someone idiotic could con an entire world. To deny that happened is burying one’s head in the ground.
As it happens, Trump did squander his inheritance, but managed to claw back his fortune, first by money laundering for Russian mobsters, then by using his political office for personal gain. Fake it until you make it very much applies here.
It reinforces my point that he is not as stupid as he looks, still having been able to persuade and manipulate people despite having little to no resources. If you have seen the movie Catch Me if You Can, it does take certain skills to get away with so much scam.
Well, call me naïve, but they are pretty cautious around this kind of stuff in Germany, I doubt the US government has access to these kinds of records.
That’s fair enough. But Trump’s Project 2025 buddies have the intention to undermine Europe. Unfortunately, when America sneezes, everyone catches the cold.
Einstein might be good at physics, but he is the last person you would ask on ecology.
Einstein was no expert on ecology, but he was well-informed about general matters. Trump is profoundly ignorant when it comes to basic knowledge you’d expect the average 12-year old to know. Like, who doesn’t know what health insurance is?
That’s fair enough. But Trump’s Project 2025 buddies have the intention to undermine Europe. Unfortunately, when America sneezes, everyone catches the cold.
Yeah, they’ve been at it even today, with JD Vance cheerleading for Orbán Viktor.
On the one hand, I think it is true that a certain kind of skill is required to read and manipulate people - the same kind of skill a conman or used car salesman needs to do their work, and that kind of skill obviously doesn’t need knowledge of quantum physics or even a rudimentary understanding of how the world in general works.
On the other hand, one shouldn’t give people like Trump, Berlusconi and Idi Amin too much credit. They ended up where they did largely due to historical happenstance, and millions of other conmen and used car salespeople stayed small-time.
Putin wasn’t the only KGB colonel before he became the president of Russia. He had peers and were given equal footing as him. But he had proven to be more cunning and ruthless than them so he gained power. Those low level conning salesmen you mentioned, they probably weren’t savvy enough. However, if they had been as savvy as the most successful con salesman, Elon Musk, then their fates would have been different otherwise.
There are those who started from the bottom, quite literally. Stalin was a pure thug who robbed banks for the Bolsheviks. He was also ridiculed for being intellectually inferior on the communist theory, especially by Lenin. And well, who lived until the ripe old age of 70, while the other was murdered in cold blood with an icepick?
I neglected to mention before and what I’m trying to say now, is to not underestimate the opponent. Once the person underestimates the opponent, is when that person loses. It’s the basic of art of war. I’m gonna be blunt, who is dumber? The person whose social security details were robbed in broad daylight, and that data is sold and fed to the private digital surveillance to train AI? It’s certainly not the dumb ketamine addicted CEO of a conglomerate of grifting companies, nor the dumb orange president who could push the red button at any notice. To think you and I are not dumb, whose details were already put into surveillance AI, are wishful thinking and coping.
Never underestimate the opposition.
Putin isn’t in the category I mentioned. Even so, Putin rapidly rose up the political ranks and in the chaos of the later Yeltsin presidency ended up prime minister largely by chance.
The numbers don’t add up. Suppose there are a million savvy conmen. How can they all become major players on the international business and political scene? There just aren’t enough of those positions.
Elon Musk started with a heap of money (as did Trump), in an oligarchic system heavily favouring those with money.
Not Lenin, who died of an unknown illness. I think you mean Trotsky.
My opposition, personally? That would be practically all politicians, ideologically, to some degree or other. I am not a member of any political organization.
One should also not overestimate them.
I used Putin as example because any sleazy jobs require the same Machiavellian instincts as with being a devious salesman. Not every dodgy salesman becomes millionaire or CEO with political leverage, because they may either happy with their gains or not ambitious enough and comfortable to remain in their stations. However, those ambitious enough beat their competition with ruthless efficiency. I’m sure there are hundreds of millionaires and billionaires who started as lowly deceptive salesman, but we just haven’t heard of them because they’re not publicly prominent.
Going back to Putin, it wasn’t really a chance on how he came to power. He was a colonel of one of the most feared spy agencies. I mean, what would you do with that much access to power if you are as ambitious as Putin? Sure, luck and happenstance also play key roles, but luck is a residue of preparation. Knowing how to take advantage of those lucky opportunities to forward own’s agenda takes certain skills to mobilise and pull the necessary levers.
A lot of people of dismiss the likes of Musk and Trump’s ability on how they got into power as being the result of being silver spooned. But people conveniently forget that it still requires knowledge, skills and experience to maintain the high status. Plenty of famous intergenerational wealthy families eventually lose their status because their descendants squander the fortunes handed to them. If Trump and Musk are stupid, they would be poor and not have gotten to the White House. So, they still have some intelligence but not about being empathetic.
I’m talking about in general on the anti-Trump camp as underestimating his stupidity. Authoritarian bodies eventually fall because of corruption and stupidity, but that’s not what is happening at the moment. The Trumpian America is just getting started and him and his cronies are smart enough on how to gain power and secure it. You may not be politically active, but they know already that you’re possibly anti-Trump because they took your social security details and other public records, and fed it into their surveillance system. Sorry to be so gloomy but I’m gonna be frank, they’re not stupid for having just robbed you, a nobody Lemmy while they are the ones in charge and spying on you.
I don’t know, I came from a former dictator run country and know how to call a spade a spade. So I will be blunt say Americans are still making heads or tails, on whether or not they are in a fascist state, because they never experienced what dictatorship is before. Constantly calling authoritarians stupid, while you and I are relying on supply chain run by them and could pressure us to conform, maybe we’re the stupid ones. Calling them stupid is coping for not accepting the fact that the inferiors outwitted us and manipulating our means of living.
This type of thinking is known as the just-world fallacy. It’s very tempting, because people prefer to believe that things happen “for a reason” and not just randomly. Yet there is no basis in reality for this type of thinking. Trump is stupid, and many of his comments can’t be explained by mere showmanship and playing to his base. The only reasonable explanation for forest raking, or negative GDP, or look, having nuclear etc. etc. is that he is a clueless idiot, and he is.
Musk is evil, and certainly no genius, but also not stupid. He has an undergraduate degree in physics, whereas Trump merely has an MBA of negligible academic standard, which certifies basic literacy at best.
The existence of markets naturally leads to an upward flow of capital from the have-nots to the haves. One of the interesting things researchers have found is that simulations with identical agents (i.e. all equally smart) and simple market mechanics lead to the emergence of extreme inequality. You can find the details in the economic literature if you’re interested.
As it happens, Trump did squander his inheritance, but managed to claw back his fortune, first by money laundering for Russian mobsters, then by using his political office for personal gain. Fake it until you make it very much applies here.
Well, call me naïve, but they are pretty cautious around this kind of stuff in Germany, I doubt the US government has access to these kinds of records.
Well like I said, Trump is stupid administratively, but he’s a good conman. Einstein might be good at physics, but he is the last person you would ask on ecology. So to repeat what I said in my original comment: there is no one type of intelligence. It’s not “just world” fallacy, one could argue that it’s “unjust world” fallacy for someone idiotic could con an entire world. To deny that happened is burying one’s head in the ground.
It reinforces my point that he is not as stupid as he looks, still having been able to persuade and manipulate people despite having little to no resources. If you have seen the movie Catch Me if You Can, it does take certain skills to get away with so much scam.
That’s fair enough. But Trump’s Project 2025 buddies have the intention to undermine Europe. Unfortunately, when America sneezes, everyone catches the cold.
Einstein was no expert on ecology, but he was well-informed about general matters. Trump is profoundly ignorant when it comes to basic knowledge you’d expect the average 12-year old to know. Like, who doesn’t know what health insurance is?
Yeah, they’ve been at it even today, with JD Vance cheerleading for Orbán Viktor.