The first batches of mRNA vaccines were terrible. One of my friends had his skin start peeling after the first shot. Two others died within a day from the third shot. One of them was an athlete who swam daily. In my country, they were pushed on everyone, babies and pregnant women, some of whom later had abortions. But I guess no one will ever admit any mistakes. it’s easier to sow division among people than to seriously look into potential side effects.
I’m not trying to defend anti-vax views, but to critique the culture of denial. Clearly, it’s difficult for many to discuss the negative aspects without dismissal, likely due to the cognitive dissonance they experience.
AI chats made people feel like everyone has to agree with them, “such a great question” “good point” The internet is so dead. soon you’ll only be talking to AI agents anyway, so enjoy the last bits of real people.
Bruh I’ve hated you pro-disease morons long before AI existed. I don’t care if “everyone agrees with me” except on topics where you’re causing children to die of preventable diseases for no fucking reason.
We had literally solved the problem of measles, and now you’ve brought it back out of pure foolishness. Those sick and dying children are entirely the fault of people like you.
I don’t know what this has to do with anything. I love it when people disagree with me. Either they make interesting points and I have fun learning something or they post drivel and I have fun with them until I get bored. It’s all upside.
Could be, but what interest would a regular person have in making things up? The only explanation I can think of is state actors, but even then, there must be something real to hold onto, even if it’s a 1 in million chance. The fact that everyone else is being dismissed makes it feel like a cult. I hate that criticizing Pfizer and Moderna has become associated with a political view, especially since these companies were involved in huge fraud scandals before.
Cue the classic Arthur meme, “do you really think someone would do that? Just go on the internet and tell lies?”
How about for money? How many grifters pushed their own protective supplements? You think pharma maybe would pay some astroturfers to push the ivermectin that didn’t do dick for anyone that didn’t have worms already because it’s fucking dewormer? How many antivaxxers made up bullshit about it just like they do every other vaccine? How many wealthy people down played everything and helped push lies so their workers would get the fuck back in the office/factory? How many people just said some stupid shit and doubled down to protect their ego when called out?
Like here’s the real issue. You’ve put no real thought at all into why someone might lie about it, as evidenced by the fact that you can only conceive of it being state actors while I came up with all those people incentivized to lie off the top of my head. And then, after putting no real effort into reflection or anything, you look around at all the people who can come up with reasons you’re wrong and claim it feels like a cult.
I’m not talking about people who had a “cure” but about those who shared their experiences openly while being censored and dismissed. People who are not part of a campaign. You assume a lot, and the way you associate everything with anti-vaxxers only shows how much governments have turned this into a political issue. If I say someone close to me had side effects after the vaccine, suddenly I’m assumed to also drink bleach and take dewormers. This is exactly the kind of propaganda they push to discredit anyone who has concerns. At this point, you’re basically unable to think critically or discuss the negative. Being part of a herd also comes with some dangerous aspects.
Because they’re scared and wanted to save face and justify their own decisions. It only takes a few to act like this, then for everyone else it becomes “I know someone that…” And so on.
Maybe you should mention where you are from. Because they definitely did not release an untested vaccine into western countries, it was tested and the bugs were worked out, somewhere.
I’m sure you can find some papers easily, I haven’t looked into it in years but just from memory there are a few vectors from which problems can arise. The immune system produces antibodies and is responsible for ensuring that they are properly reactive. If this system becomes overactivated, some antibodies may slip through and target the own body, potentially leading to an autoimmune response. We also know that breastfeeding can transfer antibodies from mother to baby. Another consideration is the stability of mRNA production from fetal stem cells. In previous experiments, this process has often been unreliable or unstable. Also the virus mutates much more rapidly than many others, so priming the immune system against a specific variant may reduce its effectiveness against other variants or different viruses.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7944975/
If not mistaken this study used by Pfizer to support its vaccine global safety, was conducted in Israel using data from Clalit Health Services. The methodology was flawed: Pfizer sponsored the study, the lead researcher had ties to the company, and there was no proper system to track side effects (unlike the U.S. VAERS system)
OK so… Here we are talking about myocarditis (at least in the first 2 articles listed), which is definitely not what you talked about in your first comment.
In the article you mentioned, I quote
“But COVID’s worse,” he added. A case of COVID-19 is about 10 times as likely to induce myocarditis as an mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccination, Wu said. That’s in addition to all the other trouble it causes.
So the vaccine has a small chance to provoke myocarditis (with very fast recovery) and not taking the vaccine has a much higher chance of provoking the same effects plus others much worse, including death.
Then, you list another article about possible autoimmune diseases induced by the vaccine. Again, not your intial topic. I’ll quote the authors:
Our objective is not to refute the importance of vaccines, but to raise awareness about the potential risks of COVID-19 vaccination. In fact, we believe that the benefits of vaccination far outweigh the possible risks and encourage people to get vaccinated
Yeah. I won’t go through all the list, but we get the picture. Nobody’s saying to get vaccinated for fun. Every single sane person should definately be curious of mass vaccination campaigns. But it is important to carefully read studies and not jump to conclusions, be them in favour or against what we believe.
Listen pal, nobody is going to sift through a dozen research articles you dump without any citation.
But just a cursory scan of the first article says .78/1000000 cases have the mentioned side effect and 1.2/1000000 have the other side effect. COVID mortality rate is something like 350x higher lol.
Life is full of risks. All medical procedures carry risks. The risk of having a serious side effect (like an allergic reaction) are less than .1% - that is a pretty low risk situation.
You might experience chills, soreness at the injection site, temporary muscle pain. These mild side effects are more common - 10-30% of people may feel these.
But, given the health risk of catching the virus. Especially now that it looks like catching covid multiple times is a bad idea. It isn’t like flu, it appears that many people experience increased severity of symptoms, some people develop long covid (which is no joke), some people can develop long-term health problems that hit their respiratory system or cause long term cardiovascular problems or develop neurological problems.
Please consider the long-term consequences of skipping vaccines.
Any medicine can have side effects its ridiculous that acknowledging that immediately labels you as an anti-vaxxer. This narrative is one of pharmas big successes imo.
In comparison, this study https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10123459/ finds that 232,000 deaths could have been prevented AMONG the unvaccinated. This is includes people who could not take the vaccine for specific health reasons who may not have died if people who could took it.
And they were voluntary to take despite it having big consequences for everyone else that some chose not to take them.
I think you mean the concept of that existing is one of the big successes of people who debate scientific topics by flooding the conversation with rapid-fire assertions and FUD.
If we don’t act fast enough, many will die. If we acted too fast with untested vaccine, people may die. I guess will and may are very important here. Would be much preferable if we didn’t suddenly discover and spread the deadly virus.
Yeah, I can definitely see the benefits. But completely dismissing the concerns of those who think differently doesn’t feel very constructive. The pharma companies basically made billions on this with zero liability, its ridiculous.
The first batches of mRNA vaccines were terrible. One of my friends had his skin start peeling after the first shot. Two others died within a day from the third shot. One of them was an athlete who swam daily. In my country, they were pushed on everyone, babies and pregnant women, some of whom later had abortions. But I guess no one will ever admit any mistakes. it’s easier to sow division among people than to seriously look into potential side effects.
I knew an athlete who had an mRNA vaccine and he died in a car accident two days afterwards. This was a very fit and healthy person who ran daily.
Hilarious, did you come up with this yourself, using your own talent?
Yeah I did, kinda like how only twelve people came up with 90% of the anti vax bullshit that got spread around during COVID.
I’m not trying to defend anti-vax views, but to critique the culture of denial. Clearly, it’s difficult for many to discuss the negative aspects without dismissal, likely due to the cognitive dissonance they experience.
If that’s your goal, the most polite thing I can say is that maybe you should reconsider your strategy.
AI chats made people feel like everyone has to agree with them, “such a great question” “good point” The internet is so dead. soon you’ll only be talking to AI agents anyway, so enjoy the last bits of real people.
Bruh I’ve hated you pro-disease morons long before AI existed. I don’t care if “everyone agrees with me” except on topics where you’re causing children to die of preventable diseases for no fucking reason.
We had literally solved the problem of measles, and now you’ve brought it back out of pure foolishness. Those sick and dying children are entirely the fault of people like you.
I don’t know what this has to do with anything. I love it when people disagree with me. Either they make interesting points and I have fun learning something or they post drivel and I have fun with them until I get bored. It’s all upside.
Probably more to do with the fact that there is, at most, a tiny grain of truth at the core, but it’s wrapped in a mountain of bullshit.
Could be, but what interest would a regular person have in making things up? The only explanation I can think of is state actors, but even then, there must be something real to hold onto, even if it’s a 1 in million chance. The fact that everyone else is being dismissed makes it feel like a cult. I hate that criticizing Pfizer and Moderna has become associated with a political view, especially since these companies were involved in huge fraud scandals before.
Cue the classic Arthur meme, “do you really think someone would do that? Just go on the internet and tell lies?”
How about for money? How many grifters pushed their own protective supplements? You think pharma maybe would pay some astroturfers to push the ivermectin that didn’t do dick for anyone that didn’t have worms already because it’s fucking dewormer? How many antivaxxers made up bullshit about it just like they do every other vaccine? How many wealthy people down played everything and helped push lies so their workers would get the fuck back in the office/factory? How many people just said some stupid shit and doubled down to protect their ego when called out?
Like here’s the real issue. You’ve put no real thought at all into why someone might lie about it, as evidenced by the fact that you can only conceive of it being state actors while I came up with all those people incentivized to lie off the top of my head. And then, after putting no real effort into reflection or anything, you look around at all the people who can come up with reasons you’re wrong and claim it feels like a cult.
I’m not talking about people who had a “cure” but about those who shared their experiences openly while being censored and dismissed. People who are not part of a campaign. You assume a lot, and the way you associate everything with anti-vaxxers only shows how much governments have turned this into a political issue. If I say someone close to me had side effects after the vaccine, suddenly I’m assumed to also drink bleach and take dewormers. This is exactly the kind of propaganda they push to discredit anyone who has concerns. At this point, you’re basically unable to think critically or discuss the negative. Being part of a herd also comes with some dangerous aspects.
Because they’re scared and wanted to save face and justify their own decisions. It only takes a few to act like this, then for everyone else it becomes “I know someone that…” And so on.
Do you mean outside of vaccine adverse event reporting system ? A system transparent and dedicated to reporting side effects ? https://www.cdc.gov/vaccine-safety-systems/vaers/index.html
I know someone who knows someone who’s friend’s postman had it and he grew a third arm!
Here’s a link to a website where you can find your intellectual companions and gaslight each other: reddit.com
Why go to Reddit? Plenty of people like you do it on here regularly as well.
Maybe you should mention where you are from. Because they definitely did not release an untested vaccine into western countries, it was tested and the bugs were worked out, somewhere.
Sources. You know. To show you’re not a tool.
I’m sure you can find some papers easily, I haven’t looked into it in years but just from memory there are a few vectors from which problems can arise. The immune system produces antibodies and is responsible for ensuring that they are properly reactive. If this system becomes overactivated, some antibodies may slip through and target the own body, potentially leading to an autoimmune response. We also know that breastfeeding can transfer antibodies from mother to baby. Another consideration is the stability of mRNA production from fetal stem cells. In previous experiments, this process has often been unreliable or unstable. Also the virus mutates much more rapidly than many others, so priming the immune system against a specific variant may reduce its effectiveness against other variants or different viruses.
Sorry but no, this is not how it works. You claim things, you show proof of things. I don’t look it up for you. Provide sources.
Here’s a few: https://www.bmj.com/content/384/bmj.q488 https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2025/12/myocarditis-vaccine-covid.html https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10108562/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9206826/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10022421/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33866000/ https://www.nationalacademies.org/news/new-comprehensive-review-examines-potential-harms-of-covid-19-vaccination-and-intramuscular-vaccination https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M23-2956 https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9021367/ https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0264410X22010283 https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/medicine/articles/10.3389/fmed.2025.1501921/full
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7944975/ If not mistaken this study used by Pfizer to support its vaccine global safety, was conducted in Israel using data from Clalit Health Services. The methodology was flawed: Pfizer sponsored the study, the lead researcher had ties to the company, and there was no proper system to track side effects (unlike the U.S. VAERS system)
OK so… Here we are talking about myocarditis (at least in the first 2 articles listed), which is definitely not what you talked about in your first comment.
In the article you mentioned, I quote
So the vaccine has a small chance to provoke myocarditis (with very fast recovery) and not taking the vaccine has a much higher chance of provoking the same effects plus others much worse, including death.
Then, you list another article about possible autoimmune diseases induced by the vaccine. Again, not your intial topic. I’ll quote the authors:
Yeah. I won’t go through all the list, but we get the picture. Nobody’s saying to get vaccinated for fun. Every single sane person should definately be curious of mass vaccination campaigns. But it is important to carefully read studies and not jump to conclusions, be them in favour or against what we believe.
No I can’t find any papers easily on that subject. So show me.
I bet you can’t find sources at all either.
https://www.bmj.com/content/384/bmj.q488
https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2025/12/myocarditis-vaccine-covid.html
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10108562/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9206826/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10022421/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33866000/
https://www.nationalacademies.org/news/new-comprehensive-review-examines-potential-harms-of-covid-19-vaccination-and-intramuscular-vaccination
https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M23-2956
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9021367/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0264410X22010283 https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/medicine/articles/10.3389/fmed.2025.1501921/full
Listen pal, nobody is going to sift through a dozen research articles you dump without any citation.
But just a cursory scan of the first article says .78/1000000 cases have the mentioned side effect and 1.2/1000000 have the other side effect. COVID mortality rate is something like 350x higher lol.
Life is full of risks. All medical procedures carry risks. The risk of having a serious side effect (like an allergic reaction) are less than .1% - that is a pretty low risk situation.
You might experience chills, soreness at the injection site, temporary muscle pain. These mild side effects are more common - 10-30% of people may feel these.
But, given the health risk of catching the virus. Especially now that it looks like catching covid multiple times is a bad idea. It isn’t like flu, it appears that many people experience increased severity of symptoms, some people develop long covid (which is no joke), some people can develop long-term health problems that hit their respiratory system or cause long term cardiovascular problems or develop neurological problems.
Please consider the long-term consequences of skipping vaccines.
It seems that you are tied with a lot of very unfortunate people. It almost seems improbable.
Any medicine can have side effects its ridiculous that acknowledging that immediately labels you as an anti-vaxxer. This narrative is one of pharmas big successes imo.
I think your making your own conclusions in order to create, for yourself, a soapbox to argue.
Nobody is saying vaccines have zero side effects. But everything has side effects, and the side effects for vaccines have been reported just like all other medications. https://www.healthline.com/health/vaccinations/side-effects-of-covid-19-vaccine#age-differences Of the more serious side effects these are mainly reported in 4-5 per one MILLION people.
In comparison, this study https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10123459/ finds that 232,000 deaths could have been prevented AMONG the unvaccinated. This is includes people who could not take the vaccine for specific health reasons who may not have died if people who could took it.
And they were voluntary to take despite it having big consequences for everyone else that some chose not to take them.
I think you mean the concept of that existing is one of the big successes of people who debate scientific topics by flooding the conversation with rapid-fire assertions and FUD.
Double edged sword.
If we don’t act fast enough, many will die. If we acted too fast with untested vaccine, people may die. I guess will and may are very important here. Would be much preferable if we didn’t suddenly discover and spread the deadly virus.
Yeah, I can definitely see the benefits. But completely dismissing the concerns of those who think differently doesn’t feel very constructive. The pharma companies basically made billions on this with zero liability, its ridiculous.
This comment is probably satire, but anybody reading this should really check out this debate https://youtube.com/watch?v=30W2w02n360.