I voted for them for tactical purposes. Both because at the time I cared about the well being of my fellow human beings and I care about my own well being. These days I’m not so sure I care about humans or even myself. I’m still grappling with the point of it all now that we’re doomed.
I understand that tactics aren’t likely your strong suit, so let me make it clear: I do not have to love the democrats as a party to vote for them. I just have to have a basic grip on reality that it was either them or fascism. Because its first past the post we are dealing with.
Tactically, it meant I reduced the risk of Trump winning. Him winning doesn’t mean abstaining from voting would have achieved that end better.
You think this is some kind of gotcha, but you are still just demonstrating a lack of understanding of what tactic’s mean. You can make tactically sound actions and still lose you fucking idiot.
It’s not a “gotcha”. If your goal was to vote out trump, you failed. That tactic did not work. How you evaluate that as tactically sound, I’m not sure.
Furthermore, I think your tactic leaves you in a strategically untenable situation.
I am saying that objectively looking at the outcome of the election means that running and supporting a pro genocide campaign was a tactical and strategic failure. You shouldn’t do that in the future.
There are many ways to interpret this response. Some are reasonable (HRC did pied piper because she thought it’d help her win) and some are unhinged and stupid (Liberals are fascists).
My tactics were to vote in primaries (when they were available…) for progressive dems. I voted for Bernie Sander’s twice. But then I voted HRC and Biden, and Harris when they were the liberal slop candidates that we got. Because the alternative was helping a fascist win.
My tactics were to canvass, advocate, donate time and money to progressive causes. And when the progressives did not fucking win the primaries, I gritted my teeth and did the same for the centrist dems.
And you know what, sure. Those tactics failed, because US citizens on average are completely selfish and stupid pieces of shit. I don’t owe your glorious revolution my life. I did not choose to be here in this hellscape, that your own advocacy helped create.
So you did what they wanted you to do, vote for the sheepdog in the primary to give you the illusion of choice and progress, they push the sheepdog aside and you are forced to vote for the candidate they wanted you to vote for from the beginning.
The only failed tactic is liberals using the same failed ones over and over, thinking this time has got to be different.
Yeah man its all just an illusion right. All the leaders are coordinating in perfect harmony to manipulate me.
Biden, in his demented state, purposefully selected Harris to serve the interests of capital… and not his own ego because she was his VP. He wasn’t insulted at all when they finally started to insist that he move aside and pick the least charismatic fucking option imaginable as a fuck you to the rest of his own party.
You know… sometimes people in power are just fucking stupid flawed narcissists. Just like the average dipshit voter is.
The revolution is going fine. 2 years ago around here, and on all social media, Democrats and Biden could do no wrong. Biden could provide the weapons to kill 10k children and Dems would still back him. Fast forward their polling numbers are in the tank, public acknowledgment that the party and it’s candidates are shit and they are tired of the same old failed policies and tactics. ‘Lesser evil’ is unacceptable because it’s not lesser.
My revolution? No one is advocating for a glorious revolution. You’re learning about the limits of electoral politics in a capitalist system. Your solution to this is to give up? That’s your right if that’s what you want.
But I don’t think you’ll actually have a choice about dying in this way.
And I think if you’re going to just give up then telling others how to vote is pretty rude.
Give up on politics in any productive sense yes because its wasted my time and energy. It still is, I’m mostly just indulging in a habit at this point.
I’d be happier just going back and hanging out with normies and never discussing politics again. I’d be happier. I’d probably be wealthier and healthier had I been doing that for the past decade and a half of my life.
People like to joke that “liberals just want to go to brunch” and you know, I’m not a liberal (I don’t agree with private ownership of the means of production) so I never really did that. I obsessed over shitty liberal rule and criticized them. But next time the libs take control (and the dems will eventually, the electorate loves to panic vote), I’m going to actually do that. I’m going to do the thing you accelerationists accused me of doing. Make sure I save up during the 4 or so years of mild stability, and go to some other country that isn’t fucking stupid.
Maybe I wont live lavishly, moving is expensive, but I’m not sticking around to help people who gleefully dragged me into bullshit. And I know I’m not the only person thinking this.
I understand the despair. And the desire to flee. And the desire for normalcy. I, too, could choose brunch, even now under the trump administration. I can also afford to flee.
But I don’t and you shouldn’t. We must build a better world.
As long as I have strength, I will work to build that vision here, in my home. With the friends and neighbors I’ve cultivated.
You hated the DNC so much you voted for them and defend their actions tooth and nail?
I voted for them for tactical purposes. Both because at the time I cared about the well being of my fellow human beings and I care about my own well being. These days I’m not so sure I care about humans or even myself. I’m still grappling with the point of it all now that we’re doomed.
I understand that tactics aren’t likely your strong suit, so let me make it clear: I do not have to love the democrats as a party to vote for them. I just have to have a basic grip on reality that it was either them or fascism. Because its first past the post we are dealing with.
Well then tactically you fucked up lol
You either don’t understand what tactics mean or you have some really Pepe Silvia shit to share with me.
You voted for genocide and still lost. Tactical and strategic woopsie.
So you don’t understand what tactics are. Or at least are pretending not to.
Ok. How was this successful tactically?
Tactically, it meant I reduced the risk of Trump winning. Him winning doesn’t mean abstaining from voting would have achieved that end better.
You think this is some kind of gotcha, but you are still just demonstrating a lack of understanding of what tactic’s mean. You can make tactically sound actions and still lose you fucking idiot.
It’s not a “gotcha”. If your goal was to vote out trump, you failed. That tactic did not work. How you evaluate that as tactically sound, I’m not sure.
Furthermore, I think your tactic leaves you in a strategically untenable situation.
Everyone has lost, and there’s more genocide.
Well there’s the same amount of genocide. But yes, we agree, and that means voting this way was a tactical and strategic failure.
Same amount in Gaza, more in the US.
Ah yes, because giving Trump the win instead has ended genocide and improved the lives of millions
Jfc you idiot. YOU STILL GAVE TRUMP THE WIN!!
I am saying that objectively looking at the outcome of the election means that running and supporting a pro genocide campaign was a tactical and strategic failure. You shouldn’t do that in the future.
Oh. Yes, agreed
Who do you think helped prop up and build the foundations for fascism? That’s what your tactics resulted in.
There are many ways to interpret this response. Some are reasonable (HRC did pied piper because she thought it’d help her win) and some are unhinged and stupid (Liberals are fascists).
My tactics were to vote in primaries (when they were available…) for progressive dems. I voted for Bernie Sander’s twice. But then I voted HRC and Biden, and Harris when they were the liberal slop candidates that we got. Because the alternative was helping a fascist win.
My tactics were to canvass, advocate, donate time and money to progressive causes. And when the progressives did not fucking win the primaries, I gritted my teeth and did the same for the centrist dems.
And you know what, sure. Those tactics failed, because US citizens on average are completely selfish and stupid pieces of shit. I don’t owe your glorious revolution my life. I did not choose to be here in this hellscape, that your own advocacy helped create.
So you did what they wanted you to do, vote for the sheepdog in the primary to give you the illusion of choice and progress, they push the sheepdog aside and you are forced to vote for the candidate they wanted you to vote for from the beginning.
The only failed tactic is liberals using the same failed ones over and over, thinking this time has got to be different.
Yeah man its all just an illusion right. All the leaders are coordinating in perfect harmony to manipulate me.
Biden, in his demented state, purposefully selected Harris to serve the interests of capital… and not his own ego because she was his VP. He wasn’t insulted at all when they finally started to insist that he move aside and pick the least charismatic fucking option imaginable as a fuck you to the rest of his own party.
You know… sometimes people in power are just fucking stupid flawed narcissists. Just like the average dipshit voter is.
You should evaluate your tactics and evaluate the limits of electoralism then. And you should adjust accordingly.
I am not going to fight and die in your stupid dumb fuck revolution (that will happen any day now I’m sure).
My tactics have changed: Understand that I can’t fix things. That I am wasting my short life trying to. Its time to seek the most pleasant oblivion.
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The revolution is going fine. 2 years ago around here, and on all social media, Democrats and Biden could do no wrong. Biden could provide the weapons to kill 10k children and Dems would still back him. Fast forward their polling numbers are in the tank, public acknowledgment that the party and it’s candidates are shit and they are tired of the same old failed policies and tactics. ‘Lesser evil’ is unacceptable because it’s not lesser.
So wait, are you saying a violent rebellion is going to happen? You actually believe that we’re on track for that?
And you think the mass death from that is going to be a good thing.
I’m going to give you an actual answer.
The federal crackdowns will breed resistance.
Resistance will cause the fascists to use more brutality. It is all they know how to do.
What do you think is going to happen? There is no vanguard or army to fight against the state abusing it’s people.
My revolution? No one is advocating for a glorious revolution. You’re learning about the limits of electoral politics in a capitalist system. Your solution to this is to give up? That’s your right if that’s what you want.
But I don’t think you’ll actually have a choice about dying in this way.
And I think if you’re going to just give up then telling others how to vote is pretty rude.
Give up on politics in any productive sense yes because its wasted my time and energy. It still is, I’m mostly just indulging in a habit at this point.
I’d be happier just going back and hanging out with normies and never discussing politics again. I’d be happier. I’d probably be wealthier and healthier had I been doing that for the past decade and a half of my life.
People like to joke that “liberals just want to go to brunch” and you know, I’m not a liberal (I don’t agree with private ownership of the means of production) so I never really did that. I obsessed over shitty liberal rule and criticized them. But next time the libs take control (and the dems will eventually, the electorate loves to panic vote), I’m going to actually do that. I’m going to do the thing you accelerationists accused me of doing. Make sure I save up during the 4 or so years of mild stability, and go to some other country that isn’t fucking stupid.
Maybe I wont live lavishly, moving is expensive, but I’m not sticking around to help people who gleefully dragged me into bullshit. And I know I’m not the only person thinking this.
Just a total waste.
I understand the despair. And the desire to flee. And the desire for normalcy. I, too, could choose brunch, even now under the trump administration. I can also afford to flee.
But I don’t and you shouldn’t. We must build a better world.
As long as I have strength, I will work to build that vision here, in my home. With the friends and neighbors I’ve cultivated.