Kamala Harris' first stop on the "107 Days" book tour was interrupted multiple times Wednesday night by protesters denouncing Israel’s war in Gaza, but the former vice president pressed on with calm.
What, specifically, was the “pro genocide platform”? Because I remember that election pretty well, and I don’t recall any advocacy of genocide, at least not from Harris.
Let’s be honest for one second. Here’s how American politics on Israel actually breaks down:
Democrats: often criticize Netanyahu but never actually cut off aid. However, several Democrats already opposed continuing aid to Israel and the rest of the party conceivably could listen to growing opposition to Israel’s war.
Republicans: actively hate all poor brown people and want Israel to kill them all. They will also use deportations and any other means available to silence anyone voicing opposition to said killing of all poor brown people.
I get that neither choice is perfect, but I really can’t see why it’s a struggle.
She did not distance herself from Biden on the subject. As the democratic nominee; heir to the Biden campaign; and then current VP in the Biden administration, this meant that her platform on Gaza defaulted to being the Biden policy.
I agree that I would rather be fighting a Harris administration over Gaza policy instead of a Trump administration. But running as a less bad version of the opposing party is not effective politics.
In that same vein, protesting a former VP from a party that is out of power is also not an effective form of activism.
You’re so caught up in left vs right that you fail to see that they are two sides of the same coin. Democrat waffling paves the way for Republican atrocities. The two parties act in concert to enact the interests of the ruling class. The only way we are getting out of this is if we abandon the framework they have indoctrinated us in, and start seeing the world clearly, as a struggle between those who have against those who have not.
Here we go again with the “we hate Israel so we won’t vote for Kamala and allow Trump to win so he can supply Israel with more bombs” crowd. Brother the entire ticket was pro Israel. Stop blaming this one issue as the reason she lost.
Whats even the point of democracy if politicians aren’t running to give people what they actually want and just point at the greater evil and say “I won’t do anything to improve your lives, but the other guy is really scary and bad!”. Can you even name a single Harris 2024 policy proposal off the top of your head?
I am not a fan of Kamala. The DNC should be dismantled for how they handled the 2024 elections.
However I consider myself somewhat educated so when I’m offered either a turd or the end of democracy as we know it as the only VIABLE options, then I’m going to choose the turd.
I will admit that the situation isn’t lost as some of the dnc leaders are at least realizing their mistake so hopefully, if we even get the chance to vote again, they will support the right people next time.
If you want to win elections, you need to give the voters what they want. You should not complain if you lose after running against what your voters want.
The difference between the dnc and rnc is that the rnc is united behind 1 set of morals that stays relatively consistent: religion. The dnc is more like a coalition of different ideas. So you are right that they should have done more to capture more voters.
However the non voters and protest voters are “cutting off their nose to spite their face”. Idk if you’re familiar with that saying but in other words they voted against genocide and instead voted for more genocide. If you don’t see how that is a fact then I’m sorry but you lack comprehension of reality and need to do WAY more research and studying so you can sit at the big kids table.
But that’s not reality and hoping for puppies and rainbows doesn’t do anything
Being happy with an untenable status quo doesn’t make it tenable.
And acting like “don’t sell weapons you know are going to be used for genocide” is an unreasonable ask in any way, acting like people who don’t want to be complicit in a genocide are asking for puppies and rainbows? That’s gross.
it’s a trolley problem. realistically, there are only two choices in the presidential election, and it’s our responsibility to vote for the one who will cause less harm. I fucking hate Kamala, but I held my nose and voted for her because trump is causing even more damage
in an ideal world, we could have a real election and vote for an actually good candidate, but that is not the world we live in
Why do people keep trying to convince me to vote how I voted in an election that already happened every time I say that democrats had no business supporting genocide?
I suppose it’s because they never intend to change their policies and expect further complicity in the future.
But all of you people who held your nose and voted for her are the reason why she felt able to run on a pro-genocide platform. If you all had more morals, the Democrats wouldn’t have felt safe running a pro-genocide candidate. (See the game can be played both ways when we decide not to blame the people who actually deserve it — those at the top).
I guess I’ll accept some possibly reasonably sized portions may in fact just be well meaning morons. Which I don’t really like saying, like I think 99% of people are totally capable and have to be trusted with making fundamental political decisions.
So, by that token 99% if people are push to shove responsible for the results of their actions. Not the intent
I think people thought by voicing it to her, she wpupd change las minute then they would vote. She didnt blink, and so these voters also didnt vote for her out of spite. And these voters still get to ctey “i did not vote for Kamala” for dubious moral high grounds.
There’s a difference between putting on a show to impress your activist buddies and actually caring about an issue. These people protesting Harris are like you, just putting on a show to aggrandize themselves. No different from the MAGAs.
The ones that allowed Trump to win are all of you who insisted on voting for a nonviable genocidal candidate despite everyone telling you “we’re not voting for her”.
You trusted media polls instead of your own eyes and ears, and you explicitly voted for genocide, and now you’re blaming those with a moral compass for refusing to vote for it.
Biden was way more pro Israel than Trump, most of Gaza was destroyed under Biden, Trump has supplied less bombs than Biden, and you’re convinced Kamala would have been better than Trump? She campaigned on most lethal military in the face of genocide protests.
You just wanted her because it’s better for America, not for Palestine. Stop making the Trump is worse argument, because Biden was way worse.
Take ownership of your moral failure so that you don’t repeat it again by campaigning for genocidal Newsom instead of revolting.
And don’t give me any bullshit about having the chance to do something under Kamala, you didn’t do anything under Biden and you’re not doing anything now, yet you’re still blaming those who had tried to do something.
You wanted status quo, you wanted comfort, you wanted Kamala to finish the genocide quietly while denying it, you wanted to get back to pretending like you have a functional democracy. And you’ll deserve everything in Trump until you find your moral compass and join those who refuse to support the “lesser evil” and revolt.
Your empire is collapsing, and your dictator is not going away without force, and your crowd are obsessed with the next election. You need to stop working, you need to stop labor, you need to revolt.
It’s uncomfortable, I know. You’ve had two years to prepare yourself, how much longer do you need?
also, genuine question, what is trump doing better than Biden? trump is causing endless trade wars and has ruined our reputation with the rest of the world
I voted to cause the least harm possible. unfortunately, both candidates were pro-genocide,so we were stuck between someone who was going to cause a lot of harm and someone who was going to cause even more harm. it fucking sucks, and I wanted to throw up while filling out my ballot, but I live in reality
This thought process makes no fucking sense though because the other guy did too…
Kamala was very obviously the “better” choice for Palestine.
Yes, she’s still a shit choice for Palestine.
But I don’t understand this logic, this person is going to let a genocide happen if we elect them, the other guy is going to let a genocide and a fascism happen.
Some people don’t like being taken advantage of as much as you do. There’s your answer. They don’t like being given no meaningful choice, and that’s what harris represented.
Put yourself in the shoes of someone who doesn’t support genocide if you can imagine it. You don’t get a primary, and the candidate you get is as pro-genocide as the one you would have voted against in the primary. You’ve been railroaded. You knew the guy the party wanted wasn’t gonna win. You know this one isn’t gonna win. You know that smug genocide supporters are gonna blame you no matter how you vote, even though they’re the ones that refuse to listen to the people. After all, they would rather you have no choice. They made that clear when they robbed you of it.
If you want to win elections, then you have to listen to the voters. If you push an unpopular genocial candidate like Kamala Harris on the voters, “the other guy is much worse” argument is not going to save you.
Makes a whole bunch of sense when you consider a lot of America still just can’t accept the idea of a woman as president, and they’ll use any excuse they can to make themselves feel better about the misogyny.
A whole lot of people wont vote for war criminals of any party, its that simple. If Harris had half a brain she would have read the polls and known she had no route to victory in supporting Israel.
If you want to now cry and point fingers, go ahead. You got maneuvered into supporting war crimes and now you want to pretend to be better than other people. You’re down in the mud with the rest of us. You’re no better or worse, but you are being a smug jerk with nothing to be smug about. Thats pathetic.
I think you think I’m like pro Harris or something, I’m very much not. I’m just talking about how utterly illogical it is to choose the greater of 2 evils.
If you can’t morally vote for a lesser war criminal I honestly understand it.
You just need to admit that you’ve helped enable trump
If you want to win elections, then you have to listen to the voters. If you push an unpopular genocial candidate like Kamala Harris on the voters, “the other guy is much worse” argument is not going to save you.
Kamala lost because she was running on a Campaign of Joy™️
The only way to win a campaign is to garner more rage than your opponent. Nixon’s campaign manager put it well- “The secret to politics is to know who hates who”. That’s how they flipped the then deep blue south into a Republican stronghold for 60 years.
Frankly I think this is why we are doomed to civil war, candidates that try to calm things down will always lose to candidates who fan the flames.
Kamala Harris ran on a pro-genocide platform and was very supportive of Israel. This was one of the reasons why she lost.
What, specifically, was the “pro genocide platform”? Because I remember that election pretty well, and I don’t recall any advocacy of genocide, at least not from Harris.
Let’s be honest for one second. Here’s how American politics on Israel actually breaks down:
Democrats: often criticize Netanyahu but never actually cut off aid. However, several Democrats already opposed continuing aid to Israel and the rest of the party conceivably could listen to growing opposition to Israel’s war.
Republicans: actively hate all poor brown people and want Israel to kill them all. They will also use deportations and any other means available to silence anyone voicing opposition to said killing of all poor brown people.
I get that neither choice is perfect, but I really can’t see why it’s a struggle.
She did not distance herself from Biden on the subject. As the democratic nominee; heir to the Biden campaign; and then current VP in the Biden administration, this meant that her platform on Gaza defaulted to being the Biden policy.
I agree that I would rather be fighting a Harris administration over Gaza policy instead of a Trump administration. But running as a less bad version of the opposing party is not effective politics.
In that same vein, protesting a former VP from a party that is out of power is also not an effective form of activism.
You’re so caught up in left vs right that you fail to see that they are two sides of the same coin. Democrat waffling paves the way for Republican atrocities. The two parties act in concert to enact the interests of the ruling class. The only way we are getting out of this is if we abandon the framework they have indoctrinated us in, and start seeing the world clearly, as a struggle between those who have against those who have not.
Here we go again with the “we hate Israel so we won’t vote for Kamala and allow Trump to win so he can supply Israel with more bombs” crowd. Brother the entire ticket was pro Israel. Stop blaming this one issue as the reason she lost.
Whats even the point of democracy if politicians aren’t running to give people what they actually want and just point at the greater evil and say “I won’t do anything to improve your lives, but the other guy is really scary and bad!”. Can you even name a single Harris 2024 policy proposal off the top of your head?
I am not a fan of Kamala. The DNC should be dismantled for how they handled the 2024 elections.
However I consider myself somewhat educated so when I’m offered either a turd or the end of democracy as we know it as the only VIABLE options, then I’m going to choose the turd.
I will admit that the situation isn’t lost as some of the dnc leaders are at least realizing their mistake so hopefully, if we even get the chance to vote again, they will support the right people next time.
If you want to win elections, you need to give the voters what they want. You should not complain if you lose after running against what your voters want.
The difference between the dnc and rnc is that the rnc is united behind 1 set of morals that stays relatively consistent: religion. The dnc is more like a coalition of different ideas. So you are right that they should have done more to capture more voters.
However the non voters and protest voters are “cutting off their nose to spite their face”. Idk if you’re familiar with that saying but in other words they voted against genocide and instead voted for more genocide. If you don’t see how that is a fact then I’m sorry but you lack comprehension of reality and need to do WAY more research and studying so you can sit at the big kids table.
The person said “one of the reasons”, as in one reason out of many. Sorry to be flippant, but jeez, people really need to learn to read.
But how can it be one of the reasons when her opponent was way worse on this issue, and all the other issues
It’s possible to be upset that you have no candidate who opposes genocide, no matter how preferable you think genocide(D) is to genocide(R).
Absolutely it is. But if you voted for trump or didn’t vote for Kamala you helped get trump elected whether you like it or not.
Wouldn’t it be lovely if it wasn’t a 2 party system where both parties are neoliberal corporate stooges.
But that’s not reality and hoping for puppies and rainbows doesn’t do anything
Being happy with an untenable status quo doesn’t make it tenable.
And acting like “don’t sell weapons you know are going to be used for genocide” is an unreasonable ask in any way, acting like people who don’t want to be complicit in a genocide are asking for puppies and rainbows? That’s gross.
it’s a trolley problem. realistically, there are only two choices in the presidential election, and it’s our responsibility to vote for the one who will cause less harm. I fucking hate Kamala, but I held my nose and voted for her because trump is causing even more damage
in an ideal world, we could have a real election and vote for an actually good candidate, but that is not the world we live in
Why do people keep trying to convince me to vote how I voted in an election that already happened every time I say that democrats had no business supporting genocide?
I suppose it’s because they never intend to change their policies and expect further complicity in the future.
But all of you people who held your nose and voted for her are the reason why she felt able to run on a pro-genocide platform. If you all had more morals, the Democrats wouldn’t have felt safe running a pro-genocide candidate. (See the game can be played both ways when we decide not to blame the people who actually deserve it — those at the top).
Because they’re really really stupid but have good intentions
I guess I’ll accept some possibly reasonably sized portions may in fact just be well meaning morons. Which I don’t really like saying, like I think 99% of people are totally capable and have to be trusted with making fundamental political decisions.
So, by that token 99% if people are push to shove responsible for the results of their actions. Not the intent
I think people thought by voicing it to her, she wpupd change las minute then they would vote. She didnt blink, and so these voters also didnt vote for her out of spite. And these voters still get to ctey “i did not vote for Kamala” for dubious moral high grounds.
Here’s how it works, and you can lay this to rest.
I am an activist. I am or knocking doors for candidates. That means I’m volunteering my own time and money.
If she isn’t willing to come my way on Palestine, why should I spend time and money on her?
That’s why she lost. We all voted, but she had no grass support.
There’s a difference between putting on a show to impress your activist buddies and actually caring about an issue. These people protesting Harris are like you, just putting on a show to aggrandize themselves. No different from the MAGAs.
I dont think you read my comment.
The ones that allowed Trump to win are all of you who insisted on voting for a nonviable genocidal candidate despite everyone telling you “we’re not voting for her”.
You trusted media polls instead of your own eyes and ears, and you explicitly voted for genocide, and now you’re blaming those with a moral compass for refusing to vote for it.
Biden was way more pro Israel than Trump, most of Gaza was destroyed under Biden, Trump has supplied less bombs than Biden, and you’re convinced Kamala would have been better than Trump? She campaigned on most lethal military in the face of genocide protests.
You just wanted her because it’s better for America, not for Palestine. Stop making the Trump is worse argument, because Biden was way worse. Take ownership of your moral failure so that you don’t repeat it again by campaigning for genocidal Newsom instead of revolting.
And don’t give me any bullshit about having the chance to do something under Kamala, you didn’t do anything under Biden and you’re not doing anything now, yet you’re still blaming those who had tried to do something.
You wanted status quo, you wanted comfort, you wanted Kamala to finish the genocide quietly while denying it, you wanted to get back to pretending like you have a functional democracy. And you’ll deserve everything in Trump until you find your moral compass and join those who refuse to support the “lesser evil” and revolt.
Your empire is collapsing, and your dictator is not going away without force, and your crowd are obsessed with the next election. You need to stop working, you need to stop labor, you need to revolt.
It’s uncomfortable, I know. You’ve had two years to prepare yourself, how much longer do you need?
also, genuine question, what is trump doing better than Biden? trump is causing endless trade wars and has ruined our reputation with the rest of the world
I voted to cause the least harm possible. unfortunately, both candidates were pro-genocide,so we were stuck between someone who was going to cause a lot of harm and someone who was going to cause even more harm. it fucking sucks, and I wanted to throw up while filling out my ballot, but I live in reality
How’s that working out? 🙈
This thought process makes no fucking sense though because the other guy did too…
Kamala was very obviously the “better” choice for Palestine.
Yes, she’s still a shit choice for Palestine.
But I don’t understand this logic, this person is going to let a genocide happen if we elect them, the other guy is going to let a genocide and a fascism happen.
Someone make it make sense
Some people don’t like being taken advantage of as much as you do. There’s your answer. They don’t like being given no meaningful choice, and that’s what harris represented.
Put yourself in the shoes of someone who doesn’t support genocide if you can imagine it. You don’t get a primary, and the candidate you get is as pro-genocide as the one you would have voted against in the primary. You’ve been railroaded. You knew the guy the party wanted wasn’t gonna win. You know this one isn’t gonna win. You know that smug genocide supporters are gonna blame you no matter how you vote, even though they’re the ones that refuse to listen to the people. After all, they would rather you have no choice. They made that clear when they robbed you of it.
If you want to win elections, then you have to listen to the voters. If you push an unpopular genocial candidate like Kamala Harris on the voters, “the other guy is much worse” argument is not going to save you.
Makes a whole bunch of sense when you consider a lot of America still just can’t accept the idea of a woman as president, and they’ll use any excuse they can to make themselves feel better about the misogyny.
A whole lot of people wont vote for war criminals of any party, its that simple. If Harris had half a brain she would have read the polls and known she had no route to victory in supporting Israel.
If you want to now cry and point fingers, go ahead. You got maneuvered into supporting war crimes and now you want to pretend to be better than other people. You’re down in the mud with the rest of us. You’re no better or worse, but you are being a smug jerk with nothing to be smug about. Thats pathetic.
I think you think I’m like pro Harris or something, I’m very much not. I’m just talking about how utterly illogical it is to choose the greater of 2 evils.
If you can’t morally vote for a lesser war criminal I honestly understand it.
You just need to admit that you’ve helped enable trump
Trump is doing a fantastic job supporting Israel in her place
If you want to win elections, then you have to listen to the voters. If you push an unpopular genocial candidate like Kamala Harris on the voters, “the other guy is much worse” argument is not going to save you.
Kamala lost because she was terrible at everything
Kamala lost because she was running on a Campaign of Joy™️
The only way to win a campaign is to garner more rage than your opponent. Nixon’s campaign manager put it well- “The secret to politics is to know who hates who”. That’s how they flipped the then deep blue south into a Republican stronghold for 60 years.
Frankly I think this is why we are doomed to civil war, candidates that try to calm things down will always lose to candidates who fan the flames.