I love how people can’t debate without writing lines for their opponent. It has the added benefit of making it easier to just tag them as a waste of time.
If you want to discuss this, I get to say my part in this- not you.
Man, y’all people think we don’t know what “implying” something is or what “reaching a natural conclusion” is. Going “oh well that’s not what I said” isn’t a gotcha. I swear reading comprehension is at an all time low if you think everything has to be said directly.
So ok, I’ll bite, what’s your glorious solution? What should we do oh wise one?
Well, considering that a Time Machine is out of the question, and the military- who happens to be capable of using satellites in space to turn every single one of you into a pink mist without even scratching the paint on your neighbors car- is not on your side, I’d say your only option is through diplomacy.
Because face it- America fucked up.
This was all avoidable back in November. There was the chance to overcome this problem- no… to avoid it all-together. But too many chose not to. They chose to make a statement. And now, sadly- everyone suffers for it. That’s it. The end.
If it helps- let’s look at it this way:
Let’s say you committed a crime¹. You are caught, and have been found guilty² Your penance, is prison³. Now, while in prison, you can plan to escape⁴, but you know that won’t work, it’s impossible, and if it were, it would only be so for someone smart enough to pull it off. That you commuted the crime and got caught, illustrates that you are not.
You’re not getting out. Plain and simple.
Now optionally, you can just sit there and stew in the colossal failure that caused you to be in there to begin with and work towards learning from your mistakes so that if/when you are released, you can do better⁵- or you can work with your lawyer(s) on your options to have your sentence overturned⁶.
Those are your options.
In this scenario:
• ¹ - didn’t vote against Trump
• ² - Trump gets elected
• ³ - Trump’s term
• ⁴ - Proposed armed uprising attempt
• ⁵ - Pay attention and be an informed voter
• ⁶ - Be active in local politics. Help in any way you are able to help move the states motions to impeach when the time comes. Work with local groups to petition state reps to act on his crimes.
It’s this or nothing.
Because if you think you have the organization, tactical knowledge, technical functionality, manpower, and arms to overcome the most powerful military on the planet, I would say go right ahead and try-
But know that in doing so- you’re gong to get a LOT of innocent people killed. It’ll be a fucking bloodbath.
And in the end, whoever remains- gets trump for life.
Lastly, do not mistake my suggesting that nothing can be done as a willingness to do nothing about it. Some people sit in prison, knowing they fucked up. They’re not giving in. They’re just quietly having the balls it takes to know they royally fucked it, and working towards understanding how they can avoid a repeat scenario.
Being a realist is not a weakness. Not is it being compliant. It’s simply accepting a circumstance that is out of one’s control.
And for the record, peaceful protest is provenly more effective than violence. Reference:
Ok so, cutting away at the chaff here, your answer was diplomacy.
That’s a have waving, dismissive and ignorant take.
First of all, you’d have to have something you can negotiate with. Something the other side wants that they don’t have. What, exactly, do the American people have that Trump doesn’t have already? He’s already got control over the American people, either through propaganda or force. If you’re thinking that the one card we have is our labor, and also think the military can obliterate us from space, then you might want to look up how the military was used through like, all of labor history through the US. Or South America.
Second, diplomacy and negotiation with whom? The Trump? The guy who’s known for not negotiating? Who goes back on every word? Negotiation comes from people trusting they are going to keep their word and Trump absolutely will not. And do you want a whole new human rights organization to throw on the pile that’s already being ignored, or do you want to utilize a new one?
Third, negotiation has been tried. Democrats “negotiate”, make concessions (which is an inevitable part of negotiating) and we get what? Just a slide to the right each time. You really want to negotiate with fascists?
Fourth, you’d also have to get everyone who’s opposed to Trump and the Republicans to organize, agree to what the terms are, and send representatives. That alone is a Herculean effort. You can’t get along with people on Lemmy, how are you going to get people to agree nationwide? Assuming you don’t get assassinated in the attempt, what negotiating power do you even have of they even would deign to meet with you?
Fifth, the military does have it’s weaknesses. A lot of soldiers do have problems with attacking us citizens in a full on war. Some would even defect. And the us military has a real hard time dealing with guerilla warfare, just look at Vietnam. Especially with supply chain issues because of the tariffs, and if there was a dismantling of the supplies and communications on the home front. So dismissing it out of hand as impossible is jumping the gun I think.
My point is that, while nonviolent revolution is a useful tool, I don’t think it’s the only tool that should be used, and we should keep other options open.
And the minute they begin to fight, Trump locks it all down and America enters into a martial law that I guarantee won’t end before his third term.
If there’s an uprising- it’ll have to be all-or-nothing- and that nothing will come at a heavy cost.
I really hope people know this is exactly what he wants. You’re being baited into giving him everything he needs.
You’re right. It’s better to just hide in your homes and hope for the best. Don’t want to play into his hands.
I love how people can’t debate without writing lines for their opponent. It has the added benefit of making it easier to just tag them as a waste of time.
If you want to discuss this, I get to say my part in this- not you.
Ok so what, work within the system? The clearly ineffectual system which isn’t working?
I didn’t say that either.
Man, y’all people think we don’t know what “implying” something is or what “reaching a natural conclusion” is. Going “oh well that’s not what I said” isn’t a gotcha. I swear reading comprehension is at an all time low if you think everything has to be said directly.
So ok, I’ll bite, what’s your glorious solution? What should we do oh wise one?
Well, considering that a Time Machine is out of the question, and the military- who happens to be capable of using satellites in space to turn every single one of you into a pink mist without even scratching the paint on your neighbors car- is not on your side, I’d say your only option is through diplomacy.
Because face it- America fucked up.
This was all avoidable back in November. There was the chance to overcome this problem- no… to avoid it all-together. But too many chose not to. They chose to make a statement. And now, sadly- everyone suffers for it. That’s it. The end.
If it helps- let’s look at it this way:
Let’s say you committed a crime¹. You are caught, and have been found guilty² Your penance, is prison³. Now, while in prison, you can plan to escape⁴, but you know that won’t work, it’s impossible, and if it were, it would only be so for someone smart enough to pull it off. That you commuted the crime and got caught, illustrates that you are not.
You’re not getting out. Plain and simple.
Now optionally, you can just sit there and stew in the colossal failure that caused you to be in there to begin with and work towards learning from your mistakes so that if/when you are released, you can do better⁵- or you can work with your lawyer(s) on your options to have your sentence overturned⁶.
Those are your options.
In this scenario:
• ¹ - didn’t vote against Trump
• ² - Trump gets elected
• ³ - Trump’s term
• ⁴ - Proposed armed uprising attempt
• ⁵ - Pay attention and be an informed voter
• ⁶ - Be active in local politics. Help in any way you are able to help move the states motions to impeach when the time comes. Work with local groups to petition state reps to act on his crimes.
It’s this or nothing.
Because if you think you have the organization, tactical knowledge, technical functionality, manpower, and arms to overcome the most powerful military on the planet, I would say go right ahead and try-
But know that in doing so- you’re gong to get a LOT of innocent people killed. It’ll be a fucking bloodbath.
And in the end, whoever remains- gets trump for life.
Lastly, do not mistake my suggesting that nothing can be done as a willingness to do nothing about it. Some people sit in prison, knowing they fucked up. They’re not giving in. They’re just quietly having the balls it takes to know they royally fucked it, and working towards understanding how they can avoid a repeat scenario.
Being a realist is not a weakness. Not is it being compliant. It’s simply accepting a circumstance that is out of one’s control.
And for the record, peaceful protest is provenly more effective than violence. Reference:
Here
Here
Here
Here
Ok so, cutting away at the chaff here, your answer was diplomacy.
That’s a have waving, dismissive and ignorant take.
First of all, you’d have to have something you can negotiate with. Something the other side wants that they don’t have. What, exactly, do the American people have that Trump doesn’t have already? He’s already got control over the American people, either through propaganda or force. If you’re thinking that the one card we have is our labor, and also think the military can obliterate us from space, then you might want to look up how the military was used through like, all of labor history through the US. Or South America.
Second, diplomacy and negotiation with whom? The Trump? The guy who’s known for not negotiating? Who goes back on every word? Negotiation comes from people trusting they are going to keep their word and Trump absolutely will not. And do you want a whole new human rights organization to throw on the pile that’s already being ignored, or do you want to utilize a new one?
Third, negotiation has been tried. Democrats “negotiate”, make concessions (which is an inevitable part of negotiating) and we get what? Just a slide to the right each time. You really want to negotiate with fascists?
Fourth, you’d also have to get everyone who’s opposed to Trump and the Republicans to organize, agree to what the terms are, and send representatives. That alone is a Herculean effort. You can’t get along with people on Lemmy, how are you going to get people to agree nationwide? Assuming you don’t get assassinated in the attempt, what negotiating power do you even have of they even would deign to meet with you?
Fifth, the military does have it’s weaknesses. A lot of soldiers do have problems with attacking us citizens in a full on war. Some would even defect. And the us military has a real hard time dealing with guerilla warfare, just look at Vietnam. Especially with supply chain issues because of the tariffs, and if there was a dismantling of the supplies and communications on the home front. So dismissing it out of hand as impossible is jumping the gun I think.
My point is that, while nonviolent revolution is a useful tool, I don’t think it’s the only tool that should be used, and we should keep other options open.