EU: How often do I have to teach you, old man?
If you have the ability to, don’t use a smartphone. You’ll be better off and you don’t have to care about stuff like this anymore.
I will pay hard cash money for some devs to bring postmarketos to quality hardware vendors.
I’m all for buying a pinephone, but man are we missing out on the full potential from some genuinely good OEM hardware stuff like razr flip.
Aside from google doing google things, android has been a bloated java pos toy OS for nearly a decade now. It completely wastes the full potential of superior hardware by running everything on a shitty JVM known as the ART that was designed for when devices had <512mb of RAM. A Nintendo 3DS can do better multi process tasking than modern android which regularly kills app threads for no reason other than to screw with you because you dared to switch to a different app for 5 seconds.
Android was supposed to be the big apple killer because of its closeness to a desktop OS with heavy emphasis on widespread features and functionality. Even technically speaking, rooting got you there if you wanted to run whatever straight on the linux environment or swap kernels.
Its nothing but a ripoff iOS clone now. Android 7/8 was probably the peak of development and usability, and even back then people were complaining it didn’t have groundbreaking improvements like 6 or lollipop.
Where are all the open source phone OSes? Where are the OS agnostic capable hardware phones? Technically some do exist, but I don’t think they have any significant market share. Hope I’m wrong though.
Essentially every browser that’s not Firefox or Safari is reskinned Google chrome for a reason. Because it’s insanely expensive to build and maintain browsers. Mobile operating systems aren’t much different in this regard.
FYI: Apple got sued for blocking other app stores. This would prevent f-droid from being installable
f-droid would be verified right?
I kinda miss my BlackBerry.
Do any alternatives allow using banking apps or android pay or android auto?
I realize there are no substitutes for banking apps, but are there any alternatives for android auto or pay if those cannot be installed? Preferably Linux alternatives.
Curve is not available in US and has terrible reviews on Play store.
I’d switch in a heartbeat, but I can’t live without a smart watch and having to pay with physical cc again would be a massive downgrade.
I have a suspicion that all the android clones will become a much worse/unusable experience once Google implements these changes.
Seriously, I see these custom Android Auto USB Sticks that people use to watch Netflix and I just want to know how they hooked into the APIs to do that
Did some research and here are your options:
- use custom mod (the new restriction only applies to certified devices). You can use microG (/e/, iode, Lineage) or sandboxing (GrapheneOS) to run apps requiring Google services. Google will still try to kill it but my bet is it will still work for at least a couple of years
- Ubuntu Touch - you can buy new devices with it, it can run android apps using waydroid but you will not be able to run any apps requiring google services. It can run native Linux apps. Native UT apps are build using QML. It has a completely new system API so it’s closer to Android then native Linux. It’s based on Halium which uses the kernel from Android
- PostmarketOS - native Linux running native Linux apps. Can use waydroid. Few supported devices but everything works on PinePhone Pro and few others phones.
- Droidian or similiar - Debian running on Halium. Kind of half way between PostmarketOS and Ubunut Touch. Native Linux but running on Android based kernel
Personally, I will stick with GrapheneOS for now (my Pixel still has at least 6 years of support). When I’m unable to run all the apps I need on it I will switch to two phones setup: stock Android for work/car apps, some Linux phone for everything else. When my Pixel dies I will switch to iPhone.
What’s a good custom ROM for a Samsung Fold 7? Just bought one and it’s my dream phone so so I don’t want to give it up so soon already, just so I can watch YouTube without ads. Planned on keeping it for at least the next 4-5 years…
If you want to use custom ROMs you have to check support before buying a phone. Fold 7 is not supported by any custom ROMs from what I can see. Also, I’m pretty sure you can just use Fennec with Adblock on stock Android and not have ads.
If you want custom roms, you have a fairly restricted set of options for phones.
Google has already started killing GrapheneOS by removing device trees from AOSP releases. Android 16 works fine, but for how long?
I would imagine the first thing any custom ROM would do is bypass Google’s app restrictions.
I wouldn’t be surprised if in 3 years I would need to pass hardware attestation to install a calculator app from the Play store.
I would imagine the first thing any custom ROM would do is bypass Google’s app restrictions.
Those restrictions don’t apply to custom ROMs. Yes, it’s clear Google is trying to kill custom ROMs but I think we still have couple of years. Linux phones are improving fast and I think in 5 years we will end up in the same spot we were with PCs 20 years ago: you will be able do most of daily driving on a Linux phones but some apps just won’t be possible to run (Authenticator apps, banking apps, Whats App, Android Auto…). Dual booting will not be possible so most probably I will end up with two phones: daily driver and work/car phone.
GrapheneOS still intends to support all the supported devices until EOL. The sideloading change doesn’t affect them. It won’t apply to GrapheneOS. It only applies to certified OSes and GrapheneOS is not certified because it doesn’t license Google Mobile Services. As per the rip out of the device trees for Pixels, that just makes Pixels like other phones. GrapheneOS has been able to expand it’s automation to build that device support themselves. For new devices, making the support will take longer than it did in the past though, but they will still support those Pixels, as long as they meet the hardware requirements and still allow third-party OS support with all security features intact. Besides that GrapheneOS is actively talking with a major Android OEM right now in order to help them reach the security requirements for a subset of their future devices. They are very optimistic about tha
Its Nothing Phone right? It has to be, LG is dead, Sony has a niche, Samsung can get fucked, Moto is budget, HMD wants to be Nokia but I just dont see it, Asus?
Ffs if I have to move to apple before the third option is stable.
I will forever lament my windows phone. Ironically, it was the only option that didn’t need to be rooted to do custom shit. You could just screw with the registry and program with .net and direct X
It didn’t live long enough to become a villan
Wasn’t Apple sued for not allowing sideloading?
You will be able sideload but the developer has to be authorized by Google. I.e. you can still install apps from f-droid but people publishing apps on f-droid will have to register with Google.
I dont have an issue with a festure to allow my phone to automatically veirfy signatures. But there should be a way to import/configure more signature verification providers including my own authority and even then it should still allow imstall if user really want and trust it.
Of course, the real issue is that it requires developers to sing up into Google’s ecosystem to distribute any apps. The entire ecosystem of mods and alternative stores will be fine but it’s just another proof Google is trying to kill it.
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Great. This could be just the boost that free android needs. Graphene and eos can brace for a few new customers i guess
I’ve been using graphene for a few months, but this latest news was what reminded me to start a monthly donation to the project. Hopefully Googles shenanigans push more people towards funding alternatives as well
I’ve gotta get a new phone soon (ol Pixel 3 is getting long in the tooth) and this is what I’m looking at too. I highly prefer the “default” Android UI, and the ability to install programs of my own choosing — but fuck Google, imagine getting locked out of your phone just because Google randomly unpersoned you.
Graphene developers seem enthusiastic to all the bullshit that Google comes up with, and on security/privacy tradeoff they seem to usually choose security. Case in point, the mandatory battery update.
CalyxOS seems to choose privacy first, but that project folded recently.
I didn’t fold. They are just reorganizing. Don’t spread misinformation.
Google getting rid of all the things that made people want an android phone over an iPhone.
Linux phones are moving fast but it feels like Android is moving faster on the other direction 😥
(Yes I know Android is built over Linux, I mean more traditional and open distros like postmarketos)
Are they moving fast? It’s been like 18 years since the iPhone came out and there really isn’t a viable Linux phone.
Wasn’t the viable Linux phone Android at first? (I am younger than the iPhone so maybe I don’t really know how it was)
By Linux I mean “FOSS” phone. Android is based on Linux, but it is also loaded with spyware out of the box. If you’d asked me 18 years ago whether there would be a viable FOSS phone by now, I would’ve thought yes. But, postmarketOS still advertises itself as “not ready yet” and Ubuntu Touch is still pretty niche.
Yep, if this happens there is no benefit to android.
I mean, there is still UI/UX, app store policies, and general cost/options.
This definitely makes Android a lot less appealing. But it is also questionable to act like the biggest reason to use android was sideloading apps since the vast majority of users don’t even know that is an option (and probably shouldn’t since they have no understanding of how to vet them). Especially since Apple isn’t any better (?).
Ui/ux is honestly worse on android compared to something like ios. The playstore is honestly stuffed with ads and seems to be actively regressing in ux (the update apps menu is hidden behind like 3 layers of dialogues). Cost wise a used iPhone is probably a better deal than a cheap new android phone.
I used android primarily because I could install apps Apple basically doesn’t care about (and after the 5th time gba4ios broke).
Comrade, the ignorance of the masses should not dilute our anger
So… “the ignorance of the masses” should be combatted by willful ignorance and nonsense that falls apart the moment anyone looks at it?
Get angry. I sure am. Look for alternatives. Graphene sure ain’t it but I hope it will be in the next four or five years. But this is something google are willing to futz with for a reason: The vast majority of users don’t care about it and even with the changes it isn’t significantly worse than the competition.
Yet everywhere I see “Well, I guess I have to buy Apple now” which is just… buy it if you want to but don’t pretend this shit is why.
It’s still a step up from iOS, which has had similar restrictions since they started.
Apple allows sideloading (somewhat), this is would be demonstrably worse (if enacted)
somewhat
Yes. Only in the EU and only since 2024 when Apple was forced to do it by new laws. It’s reasonable to assume Google would be subject to the same laws.
If you live outside if the EU, it’s “no sideload for you!” There are computer programs that can do sideloading to iPhones, but they have limitations, like having to refresh the sideloaded apps every seven days.
Wholly incorrect. You’re allowed to sideload up to 3 apps (or 10 appIDs, whichever comes first) without being a developer, and that arbitrary restriction is removed if you pay for a dev license, regardless of which part of the world you’re in.
In the EU you’re allowed to install third party app stores (still have to be notarized by Apple) which isn’t sideloading
The limitations depend on which program you’re using - there’s more than one - which is why I only gave a simple example. And if you have to pay for a function that is otherwise free to many others, that’s a limitation.
Side loading is installing an app from anywhere but the official store. So by definition “third party” is side loading. Whether it’s another store or authorised is irrelevant.
Unfortunately, that is 0.1% of their global market that is affected. So, they don’t really have much to lose.
I’m probably going to spam this around a bit, since most people don’t seem to know about it, but a reminder that FuriLabs has a (GNU+)Linux phone with decent spec.s and the ability to run Android app.s (from what I’ve heard) pretty decently: https://furilabs.com/
Biggest drawback is it’s based on Halium. Usual growing pains of a new product/company apply but apparently the company is pretty responsive and their dev.s have worked with customers to get things like calling working with the carrier and bands of their country where it hasn’t worked before so improvements move pretty quickly.
Collection of different experiences I’ve variously seen online over the last year or so:
- https://clehaxze.tw/gemlog/2025/07-20-flx1-actually-usable-linux-phone.gmi
- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41839326
- https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/1fa1ljn/furilabs_flx1/
- https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/1j46f2w/flx1_linux_phone_display_out/
- https://www.theregister.com/2025/02/03/furiphone_flx1/
I don’t own one, myself, so I can’t give any personal experience but I’ve seen it around for a few years now but most people don’t seem to even know about it. Maybe there’s a reason for that? But none I’ve ever seen anyone say.
HOLY SHIT IS THAT A HEADPHONE JACK?!
Seriously this ticks boxes Ive given up on. I never thought Id see a phone with all three: waterproof, removable battery, headphone jack. It even has wireless charging which isnt really one of my boxes but is a little extra if you use it.
Remember that brief period in the US where, for a fleeting moment, Lina Khan went after a few companies for monopolistic practices?
Yeah man, those were the days.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch
Malware-ridden apps made it into Google’s Play Store, scored 19 million downloads
https://www.theregister.com/2025/08/26/apps_android_malware/
Right, only install “verified” from Google Play, but that is where malware is, other 3rd party app stores like F-Droid, that really verify apps are at risk of getting killed by Google
This is very obviously step one in a plan to kill apps like alternative YouTube clients that block ads, just like the Manifest V3 rollout was intended to kill ad blockers in Chrome. Once they have everyone using this verification system, then they can just arbitrarily deverify anything that contravenes whatever new acceptable usage policy they just made up.
The opensource apps like Newpipe, SmartTube, termux and many others are the “malware”, not the ones with binary blobs on PlayStore that fork VLC, Newpipe and many opensource apps illegally, supposedly “verified” but don’t follow opensource license like GPL, creating fake clones with ads and (real) malware.
Google can’t keep malware off the platform now, but sure, make it mandatory you can’t go anywhere else unless they say so first.
