I had a goth friend who would always get laid without much trouble. At some point he got a normal job and had to “become a normie”, and I learned that it wasn’t because he was a goth, it was because he was a complete asshole with women, and some women, for some reason, can’t resist assholes.
Also, young people often are bad at determining how impressive someone is so they go off the social cues of just believing that they’re acting genuinely in line with their status. This means someone moderately attractive treating 21 year olds like they’re just barely worth their time can often get anything from sex to unpaid overtime if they sell it well and are indiscriminately fishing.
Most people grow out of it, but some don’t. Then there’s also that the pool isn’t a representative sample of the population. The mature and discriminate are easy to miss (they filter heavily), more likely to leave low investment pools like tinder because the effort/value proposition is bad, and when they leave because of relationships will take longer to return to the pool. It’s not that all the good ones are taken, its that most of the bad ones are looking.
I’ve known many women who were very nice and intelligent, who dated assholes. Usually they end the relationship thinking “ugh, why did I do that? That guy was such an asshole.”
They do this because women are human, and do the very human thing of making mistakes and regretting them.
They do this because [even nice and intelligent] women are human horny, and do the very human horny thing of making mistakes and regretting them.
Bad/terrible people can be hot. In fact, often when people are hot they feel more free to be their natural asshole selves because they can get away with it more. This applies to both men and women in all directions.
In fact, some people want their partner to be mean to them, its more often hetero women who like that. If a guy can be mean and get away with it, that implies they’re hot shit, extremely confident, rich, and/or powerful. Those are attractive features in a guy.
There are also hetero men who want women to be mean to them, especially in the bedroom.
I find that spanning inferential distances is typically best accomplished by starting from obvious facts. When you say something that sounds dumb because it is so obvious, you’ve found a good starting point for creating shared understanding.
I wonder if there are more assholes than normal people, so that it only seems that assholes are more successful in dating because there are simply more of them.
It can work by sampling biases. Let’s say you have a hundred marbles, 99 blue, 1 orange, each has a number on it. Each day you pull out 5, if it’s blue you roll a d20 and on a 20 you keep it out for 1d20 turns. If it’s orange you put it back without rolling, but you have to do a push up.
It will feel like there’s way more orange than any individual blue. Why? The orange is more noticeable at a glance, it changes the interaction from routine, and the blue marbles have a chance to leave the bag for a few turns and so once it’s gotten going the bag often has more than 1% orange in it.
The default on tinder is swipe, no match, but if match no conversation, but if conversation it goes nowhere, but if it goes somewhere it doesn’t lead to a date, at which point if it does lead to a date suddenly you’re thinking of this person as out of ths ordinary and may be remembered. Maybe a relationship happens which removes you both from the pool for an indeterminate amount of time
Assholes are noticeable, they’re memorable, and they’re already a few steps in. Then when they do enter a relationship it’s likely to be on the shorter end because they just kinda suck, so they go back into the pool faster.
If there are more arseholes than non-arseholes, then the arseholes are the ‘normal’ people. That’s why I stay inside. I’m also trying reconcile with myself the possibility that I’m also an arsehole, just the wrong sort of arsehole.
Deeply communicating that you are an asshole, by continuing to be pretentious?
By showing that you are actually confident that being consistently pretentious is a good way to showcase this, despite claiming you have no confidence?
By disproving that your asshole status is self-evident, by showcasing that it actually requires a sustained interaction to demonstrate this?
I dunno, I’ve been around a lot of assholes, constantly contradicting themselves in ‘clever’ ways is pretty bog standard behavior.
In my case, you’re wrong, the guy is like a tank, insecurity is not the case. I see some people trying to “dig deeper”:
“maybe the women have insecurities, so it is them who are to blame”
“maybe the asshole is not an asshole, he just has a childhood trauma”
No, he is a confident asshole, and his “charm” works one some women (and not each of them falls into made-up categories). People look for patterns too much. “I’m a red-piller” - lol, that’s a first.
Note, I’m not protecting the guy, but he is not a comic-book villain with an origin story. He just happens to be successful in finding one-night stands because of a personal trait.
Edit: forgotten line breaks
When you say things like “some women can’t resist assholes” it sounds like red pill rhetoric. A better way to say it might be like “some assholes prey on women’s insecurities”. Keep the focus on the person who is the problem, not the victims.
A better way to say it might be like “some assholes prey on women’s insecurities”. Keep the focus on the person who is the problem, not the victims.
idk I think that’s needlessly condescending to women, not all of them dating assholes are victims, some just like assholes because they like asshole behavior because they’re also an asshole.
When you say things like “some assholes prey on women’s insecurities” it’s incredibly condescending, especially when you consider that women can also be assholes.
Like begets like. I’ve known too many couples where both of the people in the relationship are trash.
The amount of tone policing here is fantastic, everyone is finding something problematic about what is being said even though the actual effect is mostly agreed on
Well, to be fair, I don’t find anything problematic with saying some women can’t resist assholes.
If you were to suggest that all women can’t resist assholes, 100% that’s red pill garbage. Suggesting that the first statement is red pilled rhetoric is a false correlation, and I’m saying this as someone who is very protective of the women in my family.
That being said, I would also never suggest that some women aren’t victims of cycles of abuse. That would be morally reprehensible and delusional, to put it lightly.
Correcting ‘some women can’t resist assholes’ with ‘some assholes prey on women’s insecurities’ doesn’t strike you as assuming that these women are all victims?
Ok, sure — I’m not going to debate this any further.
Saying that some people might be susceptible to certain kind of exploitation doesn’t imply that all people of that group alhave that issue, or that they’re somehow inferior
This also takes away agency from people. In fact, I am sure that there would be a way to diagnose every single relationship ever as a form of abuse in which someone takes advantage of someone else’s something.
Adults are responsible for their choices, and particularly in the case of “assholes”, that is often associated with being assertive, dismissive and some people just like that kind of “I am the main character” features. Maybe there are even some deep rooted evolutionary reasons for that, I don’t know.
Anyway, painting anything as victim-oppressor dichotomy IMHO is nonsense.
Many men, and women, and every other kind of human, often mistake confidence and decisiveness … for competence, reliability, trustworthiness, responsibility.
…
This is by no means totally specific to a sex or gender, it applies broadly, in all kinds of social situations, business relationships, etc, between all kinds of genders and sexes.
This innappropriate or overweighted heuristic tendency also tends to lessen with age, as people gain first hand experience and knowledge that this heruistic, this intuition, this assumption… is actually often not accurate.
…
Anybody with decent charisma, which a huge component of is an above average, but not overwhelming level of outwardly displayed confidence, stands a better chance at convincing most people of basically anything, intentionally or unintentionally.
Lots of overly confident people bulldoze into a situation, legitimately believing they were well equipped to handle it in an ethical way, only later to realize… oh, I am in way over my head, I fucked up.
Lots of overly confident people also just know they are full of shit, and intentionally bulldoze through, and then either gaslight about how they did nothing wrong, or just fucking vanish.
This again works beyond just interpersonal romantic relationships:
For every bonafide grifter con artist (crypto for dudes, cosmetics MLMs for gals), there is a well intentioned new boss or manager who basically accidentally fucks up the entire department out of inexperience and hubris…
And both of those are often aided by their natural, above average levels of confidence and charisma.
But you mirrored both the genders and the way responsibility flows.
Some men and women are assholes who prey on the inexperienced, some men and women are naturally more confident than most, and give others a false impression, mostly or entirely unintentionally.
You don’t seem to accept that some people can accidentally lead people on without actually trying to do that, that one person’s obvious flirting can be another person’s just trying to be friendly, that one person can never explicitly say that ‘this is a committed, serious relationship’, and another person can hear that anyway.
It’s not just preying on their insecurities. Everyone has insecurities, but not everyone will let you into their pants just for calling them a worthless piece of shit or something. The women in question must have some deeper issues. Because I also have a friend who demonstrated to me how you can just go on Tinder and write horrible shit to women and get surprisingly good results.
I had a goth friend who would always get laid without much trouble. At some point he got a normal job and had to “become a normie”, and I learned that it wasn’t because he was a goth, it was because he was a complete asshole with women, and some women, for some reason, can’t resist assholes.
Being an asshole implies confidence.
Women like confidence.
Inexperience and young girls mistake being a dick with confidence
Also, young people often are bad at determining how impressive someone is so they go off the social cues of just believing that they’re acting genuinely in line with their status. This means someone moderately attractive treating 21 year olds like they’re just barely worth their time can often get anything from sex to unpaid overtime if they sell it well and are indiscriminately fishing.
Most people grow out of it, but some don’t. Then there’s also that the pool isn’t a representative sample of the population. The mature and discriminate are easy to miss (they filter heavily), more likely to leave low investment pools like tinder because the effort/value proposition is bad, and when they leave because of relationships will take longer to return to the pool. It’s not that all the good ones are taken, its that most of the bad ones are looking.
Alright alright alright
Certain women like asshole confidence. Typically the type to write “I’m a bitch, deal with it” in their bios
I’ve known many women who were very nice and intelligent, who dated assholes. Usually they end the relationship thinking “ugh, why did I do that? That guy was such an asshole.”
They do this because women are human, and do the very human thing of making mistakes and regretting them.
Bad/terrible people can be hot. In fact, often when people are hot they feel more free to be their natural asshole selves because they can get away with it more. This applies to both men and women in all directions.
In fact, some people want their partner to be mean to them, its more often hetero women who like that. If a guy can be mean and get away with it, that implies they’re hot shit, extremely confident, rich, and/or powerful. Those are attractive features in a guy.
There are also hetero men who want women to be mean to them, especially in the bedroom.
I can find no fault with anything you just said. Except maybe that having a thing for being abused spans all genders and sexual identities.
Big if true
I find that spanning inferential distances is typically best accomplished by starting from obvious facts. When you say something that sounds dumb because it is so obvious, you’ve found a good starting point for creating shared understanding.
sometimes you dont realise theyre an asshole until youre already a year plus deep
Yeah, new relationship energy will fucking get you sometimes
yeah im still feeling the repercussions of the one i went through 5 years after it ended
The women that like arseholes, believe it or not, are also probably arseholes.
I wonder if there are more assholes than normal people, so that it only seems that assholes are more successful in dating because there are simply more of them.
It can work by sampling biases. Let’s say you have a hundred marbles, 99 blue, 1 orange, each has a number on it. Each day you pull out 5, if it’s blue you roll a d20 and on a 20 you keep it out for 1d20 turns. If it’s orange you put it back without rolling, but you have to do a push up.
It will feel like there’s way more orange than any individual blue. Why? The orange is more noticeable at a glance, it changes the interaction from routine, and the blue marbles have a chance to leave the bag for a few turns and so once it’s gotten going the bag often has more than 1% orange in it.
The default on tinder is swipe, no match, but if match no conversation, but if conversation it goes nowhere, but if it goes somewhere it doesn’t lead to a date, at which point if it does lead to a date suddenly you’re thinking of this person as out of ths ordinary and may be remembered. Maybe a relationship happens which removes you both from the pool for an indeterminate amount of time
Assholes are noticeable, they’re memorable, and they’re already a few steps in. Then when they do enter a relationship it’s likely to be on the shorter end because they just kinda suck, so they go back into the pool faster.
deleted by creator
If there are more arseholes than non-arseholes, then the arseholes are the ‘normal’ people. That’s why I stay inside. I’m also trying reconcile with myself the possibility that I’m also an arsehole, just the wrong sort of arsehole.
Damn I need to power off. I’m like how does anyone write in their BIOS? I’m pretty sure it’s just settings. 😅
Aren’t all operating systems bi(nary)?
/s don’t @me about ternary computers
Edit: actually do @me about ternary computers, I looked them up and they’re cool as shit
LOL
It’s not that hard, the trick is using your computer after.
deleted by creator
Look at coreboot. You can flash your bios with open source software!
No. Hi. Asshole here; zero confidence.
Well I’d ask you to prove you’re an asshole, but apparently you don’t believe you could?
=P
No, inverse; i think it’s self evident.
Perhaps ironically, this is pretentious enough to convince me that you may indeed be an asshole.
Task failed successfully?
Or im just communicating on a deeper level than you.
Deeply communicating that you are an asshole, by continuing to be pretentious?
By showing that you are actually confident that being consistently pretentious is a good way to showcase this, despite claiming you have no confidence?
By disproving that your asshole status is self-evident, by showcasing that it actually requires a sustained interaction to demonstrate this?
I dunno, I’ve been around a lot of assholes, constantly contradicting themselves in ‘clever’ ways is pretty bog standard behavior.
Now you begin to understand.
My appearance should do, but, alas.
nope. it implies a craven amount of insecurity.
it says something though that so many people assume this, it’s certainly not just you.
Whatever. It gives off the impression of confidence. We’re trying to explain observed phenomena here, not cast moral judgements.
In my case, you’re wrong, the guy is like a tank, insecurity is not the case. I see some people trying to “dig deeper”:
No, he is a confident asshole, and his “charm” works one some women (and not each of them falls into made-up categories). People look for patterns too much. “I’m a red-piller” - lol, that’s a first.
Note, I’m not protecting the guy, but he is not a comic-book villain with an origin story. He just happens to be successful in finding one-night stands because of a personal trait.
Edit: forgotten line breaks
a lot of people who over-invest on physical attributes have serious insecurities.
I hold to my premise. it in no way discredits him being an asshole in his coping with these issues.
Not strong like a tank, I meant by attitude. Ok, you invent whatever person you want in your head.
When you say things like “some women can’t resist assholes” it sounds like red pill rhetoric. A better way to say it might be like “some assholes prey on women’s insecurities”. Keep the focus on the person who is the problem, not the victims.
idk I think that’s needlessly condescending to women, not all of them dating assholes are victims, some just like assholes because they like asshole behavior because they’re also an asshole.
When you say things like “some assholes prey on women’s insecurities” it’s incredibly condescending, especially when you consider that women can also be assholes.
Like begets like. I’ve known too many couples where both of the people in the relationship are trash.
The amount of tone policing here is fantastic, everyone is finding something problematic about what is being said even though the actual effect is mostly agreed on
Well, to be fair, I don’t find anything problematic with saying some women can’t resist assholes.
If you were to suggest that all women can’t resist assholes, 100% that’s red pill garbage. Suggesting that the first statement is red pilled rhetoric is a false correlation, and I’m saying this as someone who is very protective of the women in my family.
That being said, I would also never suggest that some women aren’t victims of cycles of abuse. That would be morally reprehensible and delusional, to put it lightly.
Anyone can be a victim, condescension has nothing to do with that.
And anyone can be an asshole, assuming that all women are simply victims is 100% condescending towards women.
That wasn’t stated
Correcting ‘some women can’t resist assholes’ with ‘some assholes prey on women’s insecurities’ doesn’t strike you as assuming that these women are all victims?
Ok, sure — I’m not going to debate this any further.
Nowhere it was stated that ALL women are victims.
Saying that some people might be susceptible to certain kind of exploitation doesn’t imply that all people of that group alhave that issue, or that they’re somehow inferior
Yeah, sure — whatever.
This also takes away agency from people. In fact, I am sure that there would be a way to diagnose every single relationship ever as a form of abuse in which someone takes advantage of someone else’s something.
Adults are responsible for their choices, and particularly in the case of “assholes”, that is often associated with being assertive, dismissive and some people just like that kind of “I am the main character” features. Maybe there are even some deep rooted evolutionary reasons for that, I don’t know. Anyway, painting anything as victim-oppressor dichotomy IMHO is nonsense.
How about:
Many men, and women, and every other kind of human, often mistake confidence and decisiveness … for competence, reliability, trustworthiness, responsibility.
…
This is by no means totally specific to a sex or gender, it applies broadly, in all kinds of social situations, business relationships, etc, between all kinds of genders and sexes.
This innappropriate or overweighted heuristic tendency also tends to lessen with age, as people gain first hand experience and knowledge that this heruistic, this intuition, this assumption… is actually often not accurate.
…
Anybody with decent charisma, which a huge component of is an above average, but not overwhelming level of outwardly displayed confidence, stands a better chance at convincing most people of basically anything, intentionally or unintentionally.
Lots of overly confident people bulldoze into a situation, legitimately believing they were well equipped to handle it in an ethical way, only later to realize… oh, I am in way over my head, I fucked up.
Lots of overly confident people also just know they are full of shit, and intentionally bulldoze through, and then either gaslight about how they did nothing wrong, or just fucking vanish.
This again works beyond just interpersonal romantic relationships:
For every bonafide grifter con artist (crypto for dudes, cosmetics MLMs for gals), there is a well intentioned new boss or manager who basically accidentally fucks up the entire department out of inexperience and hubris…
And both of those are often aided by their natural, above average levels of confidence and charisma.
I’m fine saying “many people prey on other people’s insecurities.” I am not “making this about gender.” I was mirroring the genders I was replying to.
But you mirrored both the genders and the way responsibility flows.
Some men and women are assholes who prey on the inexperienced, some men and women are naturally more confident than most, and give others a false impression, mostly or entirely unintentionally.
You don’t seem to accept that some people can accidentally lead people on without actually trying to do that, that one person’s obvious flirting can be another person’s just trying to be friendly, that one person can never explicitly say that ‘this is a committed, serious relationship’, and another person can hear that anyway.
If you think I’m mirroring everything the other person said, why are you criticizing my words instead of theirs?
I keep the focus where I want, that doesn’t change the asshole-victim situation, and I won’t save anyone if I change the wording.
Obviously you can do what you want, you have free will.
It’s not just preying on their insecurities. Everyone has insecurities, but not everyone will let you into their pants just for calling them a worthless piece of shit or something. The women in question must have some deeper issues. Because I also have a friend who demonstrated to me how you can just go on Tinder and write horrible shit to women and get surprisingly good results.
That’s just a loop like how people ask which came first… hen or egg